Question about the Warforged

[Shae]

This is a roleplaying pronblem: not a mechanics issue. He has done nothing wrong mechanically.

It becomes a mechanic issue when no one is capable of standing up to his character. His AC for his character and his humunculi are nearly, if not completely, beyond what we can hit. Within a matter of turns he could kill the whole party. Where is the fun of playing with someone who strongarms the other players and there is no other recourse than some sort of nuke? When the Gm throws powerful creatures our way and that doesn't even phase him, but it almost certainly hurts us, what other recourse but extreme recourse is there?

I mean, honestly, if this is what D&D has become, then this is ridiculous. I was brought in in an attempt to make the game fun for the other players. It's not fun with this character, but I don't want to tell the other players and the GM that it's a lost cause. I'm at a loss as to what I can do to correct this situation. He's upset a powerful cleric, but if the big bads of the monster manuals can't phase the character, what else can be done to at least curb him a bit? The one humunculi idea is a start, but I'm not sure how that will fly. If I can enact something in-game to curb it, then good.

While I really just want to see this character die, I can accept an in-game consequence for his latest actions that will put him into an equal footing with the other players.

 

[Starbuck_II]

It becomes a mechanic issue when no one is capable of standing up to his character. His AC for his character and his humunculi are nearly, if not completely, beyond what we can hit. Within a matter of turns he could kill the whole party. Where is the fun of playing with someone who strongarms the other players and there is no other recourse than some sort of nuke? When the Gm throws powerful creatures our way and that doesn't even phase him, but it almost certainly hurts us, what other recourse but extreme recourse is there?

I mean, honestly, if this is what D&D has become, then this is ridiculous. I was brought in in an attempt to make the game fun for the other players. It's not fun with this character, but I don't want to tell the other players and the GM that it's a lost cause. I'm at a loss as to what I can do to correct this situation. He's upset a powerful cleric, but if the big bads of the monster manuals can't phase the character, what else can be done to at least curb him a bit? The one humunculi idea is a start, but I'm not sure how that will fly. If I can enact something in-game to curb it, then good.

While I really just want to see this character die, I can accept an in-game consequence for his latest actions that will put him into an equal footing with the other players.

Post his character: I'm sure he has some weakness.

The thing is you only see him at his strongest. Artificers (most of their buffs) take a minute to cast; though some of presonal buffs are stanhdard actions.

Till we see the Hommunculi: we can't know how strong it actually is.

More than likely most AC is natural armor and terrible touch AC.

So send Warlocks, ToB warriors (Swordsage or Warblade), rogues with Chill Touch blade from Magic Item Conpendruim, etc.

Heck, a Wizard with that 2nd levl spell Scorching ray metamagiced.

 

[irdeggman]

It becomes a mechanic issue when no one is capable of standing up to his character. His AC for his character and his humunculi are nearly, if not completely, beyond what we can hit. Within a matter of turns he could kill the whole party. Where is the fun of playing with someone who strongarms the other players and there is no other recourse than some sort of nuke? When the Gm throws powerful creatures our way and that doesn't even phase him, but it almost certainly hurts us, what other recourse but extreme recourse is there?

First off 3.5 (and 3.0 for that matter) was designed to award xp for "team play" and not for individual play. There were optional rules in 2nd that awarded xp to each class based on their individual actions so that they ended up "competeing" for xp.

In 3.5 all xp (except for role-playing awards) are awarded to the entire party.

Keep this in mind (both of you co-DMs). It is an inherent design of the game "team play" not "individual actions".

 

[irdeggman]

Check the Eberron books to ensure you (and your co_DM) understand the rules the player is using.

If the DM does not know (or have access to a set of rules or options) he is under no obligation to allow them into the game and should not blindly do so.

the PC is a 4th level artificer that means that his homunculus is limited to 2 HD (the crafter's HD - 2) and never larger than a small creature.

The base homunculus (from the MM) has 2d10 HD (11 hit points), AC 14, touch 14, flat-footed 12. It is a tiny creature hence a +2 to AC due to size, if grown to small then this AC bonus drops to +1).


Cost to create the base one is: 1050 gp and 78 xp. Note that it takes 1 day per 1000 gp of the items's base price (not the material costs). So depending on how you look at it it either takes 2 days or 4 to craft 1 homonuculus (4 if you assume that the cost to create is 1/2 the base price {which doesn't exit for one since they can't be "sold" or "bought}


Note that it is a construct so any buffs that target humanoids will not work on it (the same applies to the warforged). This is something very important to remember a warforged is not a humanoid it is a living construct so spells like enlarge person do not work.

Note also that if the homunculus is slain the master takes 2d10 points of damage.

As noted most infusions have 1 minute or longer casting times, which can be changed to 1 round by using an Action Point. But if the artificer has AP then so do the rest of the PCs (check out the various AP related feats and uses for APs). If no one else has APs then neither does the artificer.

 

[irdeggman]

Also note that warforged do not heal damage naturally, unlike other PCs. So "resting" won't do it. And any cure spells only do half effect on them.

Note that warforged have a +2 AC due to their natural plating which is an armor bonus so it does not stack with any other armor bonus. They can't even wear any armor, or robe since this plating occupies the same body space as armor or robes do.

Max ranks for UMD for a 4th level artificer is 7 (level + 3) so even with various bonuses due to class feature and high Charisma (oops warforged take a -2 hit to Charisma, so this is off set by the class feature) there is only a reasonable bonus available. And the artificer pretty much always make a UMD check to use any item he creates.

 

[Starbuck_II]

Note that warforged have a +2 AC due to their natural plating which is an armor bonus so it does not stack with any other armor bonus. They can't even wear any armor, or robe since this plating occupies the same body space as armor or robes do.

They can wear armor if take unbodied feat: that one rewmoves the armored plating letting them wear armor.

 

[Angrydad]

Warforged as a race are fairly powerful for having no Level Adjustment, but I think the whole not needing to eat/sleep/breath thing is hampered by their lack of natural healing, resistance to healing magic, and weakness to rust and similar effects. The race itself isn't capable of tons of damage, which the OP seemed to be saying upthread, but an artificer with the right combo can be a pretty powerful force, regardless of race.

At the OP, please show us the character's stats and the info on the homonculi so we can all dissect it for you. I'm having a hard time grasping the 30+ AC for a level 4 character.

 

[Shae]

Next time we game, I will definitely try to get my hands on the character (as I think that the GM needs copies of all the sheets anyway). It'll just be a little bit more time before I can post it..

 

[irdeggman]

They can wear armor if take unbodied feat: that one rewmoves the armored plating letting them wear armor.

Correct - if you choose to waste one of your level based feats on such a thing instead of other, better ones. Mythral body comes to mind. But the artificer only has ASF with light armors - so why bother?.

The PC in question would only have 2 feats to use (1st level and 3rd level) on such a thing, and IIRC all of the "body" feats must be taken at 1st level (and only 1 of them can be taken).


Oh and OP don't forget the errata on artificers (basically any item they create is neither arcane nor divine - so no arcane scrolls for the wizard to borrow and scribe for his spel book).

 

[Runestar]

The warforged should be able to access wands of repair, so healing shouldn't be an issue.

I finally found the article on boosting eq. It basically relies on stacking multiple buffs, and requires that you take 1 lv in cloistered cleric for turn undead.

Since Artificers get all their stuff very, very cheap they can have some damn good equipment at that level.

20 Dex, Bracers + 7, and a shield spell alone is 26. Then Bite of the Werebear + Scintillating Scales = 33, then start adding Ghost Ward, +1 insight, Law Devotion... 50. And all of that is on all day except Law Devotion which is only a Swift action, and can be used 4 times a day with Cha 22 (or Cha 14 and one Nightstick, but the character was built in a ruleset that did not allow nightsticks).

About the only weakness a Persist user has is Dispel, except you can Extraordinary Spell Aim AMFs at that level to be immune. Or spellblades, or whatever. Well, there's also a better Persist user, but that goes without saying. The AMF isn't needed otherwise, as the build also has 27/24/27 saves and can reroll any natural 1 once = most stuff at that level has a 99.75% chance to fail against him.

Yes, the artificer is that abusive. And people wonder why it is in a 4-way tie for most powerful class...