Pathfinder 1E Question for the Paizo folks regarding D&D's state of today

[Hussar]

Quite a bit actually, helps. What you assume is that we dont have-odd schedules, rural or slower comminties or other such items.

What you dont know is, I happened to live, as I call it, a gaming dead zone. There is NOTHING around me. Nearest game store? about an hour in whatever direction, maybe 45 minutes(so thats, for you Hussar, 30-60 miles away). Howeevr both stores such monkey behinds and have done nothing for me, gaming wise for RPG's.

Online gets you people and places. I am pretty much, judging by the gamer meet up, maybe one of two for the area. I'd have to travel around anyway.

As for more then once a week? Your SOL. We're adults, time is limited. Its not college or HS anymore. Jobs, house, spouse, kids eat up alot of time. Once a week, or 2-4 a month work well for me as an adult.

So in the end? Online is ok, but will never ever take away from face to face. BTDT online gaming. Its ok in a pinch, but doesnt take the place of face to face.

Is it easy to get a group together? No but I am in a dead zone, and fit your critiera. You have to look hard and make it work, and yeah I travel 45 minutes for my game- 30+ miles each way. But its an awesome game, so I'd travel double that one for this game easy.

Games worth having take work.

Different strokes. I'll stand my online games up against anyone's tabletop game any day of the week.

And, for quite some time, I got to play twice a week, despite my insane schedule. I still play Tuesday mornings 9 to noon after I get the kids off to school.

BTW, BTDT? Not familiar with that acronym. What does that mean.

 

[Alzrius]

BTW, BTDT? Not familiar with that acronym. What does that mean.

Been There Done That.

 

[carmachu]

Different strokes. I'll stand my online games up against anyone's tabletop game any day of the week.

And, for quite some time, I got to play twice a week, despite my insane schedule. I still play Tuesday mornings 9 to noon after I get the kids off to school.

BTW, BTDT? Not familiar with that acronym. What does that mean.

Been There, Done That.......BTDT

Not to brag, but I can absolutely guarentee that when you stack up any of your online games to our Ptolus game at teh table? It loses. I'd bet money on it. Four years running strong, no signs of let up. Easily the best group that I had th epleasire of gaming with since HS 1st edition....

But as you said, different strokes....

 

[ProfessorCirno]

As someone who's moved several times in his life, online games are pretty much incredibly awesome.

 

[Starman]

I think it's time to get the tape measure out.

 

[Aberzanzorax]

I don't wish to be a jerk here, but my experience is the direct opposite:

As someone who has moved several times in his life, online games are a poor and inferior substitute.


I have a GREAT (by that I mean, my favorite game I've ever dmed...and I think my favorite dm offering to my players) campaign that started online.

But it died...too much confusion...too much prep making maps, too many difficulties connecting.


We want to pick it up again, and the offerings out there are STILL not able to get us going.


Now, that said, I'd agree with two things:
1. Online games are not as good as face to face, but they're better than not gaming.

2. If a smooth, easy to use (including easy to make maps ahead of time and easy to connect and easy to interact) program were released, I'd jump at the chance to use it.


So, when and where I can't meet with my friends due to real life constraints, I'd settle for an adequate (or great) online gaming table. But if I could meet with friends, I don't think I'd ever want it or use it.

 

[Hussar]

I don't wish to be a jerk here, but my experience is the direct opposite:

/snip

I can totally appreciate that. My first experience online with OpenRPG was a horrible mess. Just bad all the way around. Players vanishing into the darkness with no warning, piss poor programs that were full of bugs, Internet issues, gack. Totally understand.

But, I persevered and I now have a fantastic group that is rock solid. It did take a LONG, PAINFUL time to get there though. :/

But if I could meet with friends, I don't think I'd ever want it or use it.

I've asked myself this question a few times. It's not going to happen, just due to my current situation, but, I'm honestly not sure. I think what would likely happen is that I would simply play more often - once a week (if that) with my face to face group and my regular game (s) online. They are different experiences, but, I honestly do not believe they are inferior.

 

[Dykstrav]

In the long run, there may not be a choice. If D&D really is the single gateway to the RPG community, and that gateway moves online, then the community will eventually migrate along with it. And when 90%+ of the RPG players are online, other game makers will have to follow them or wither away.

There are many times that I agree with what you say Dausuul, but unfortunately, this isn't one of them.

I think that many people equate a single company with the entire industry, and regardless of how prominent a single company is, it will just never pan out that way. I'm not necessarily saying that I think Paizo (or another company) will eclipse WotC for market dominance on a six-month timetable or anything like that. I do think that if WotC moved entirely online, some other company would step up and try to proclaim themselves the "inheritors of D&D." it has become quite fashionable, of late, to contradict WotC at every turn for a myriad of reasons--but mostly just because it's hip to do so. I think that someone would try to capitalize on that and make it work in some fashion.

Would such a competitor be able to compete with WotC? I don't know, but I really doubt it. But as the architect said in the Matrix Reloaded, "there are degrees of survival." I'm sure that a few small or tiny operations (relatively speaking, considering that we are talking about RPG companies after all) would be able to keep something in print and figure out a way to earn some scratch from it.

Arguably, the splintering of the fan base that we're witnessing right now is because of competing interests all trying to loudly proclaim themselves as the bearers of the "one true D&D" since 4E was released. If D&D did go entirely (or mostly) online, it would only exacerbate the situation even further.

 

[Alzrius]

But as the architect said in the Matrix Reloaded, "there are degrees of survival."

Actually, he said "There are levels of survival..."

And I'm guessing that if WotC moved D&D to being entirely online, then somebody else would indeed gain some levels.

 

[Banshee16]

I have a great deal of respect for you, Erik, both for your success at Paizo and your previous work. And I must say that your analysis here scares the hell out of me. Are they really so short-sighted that they will torpedo the entire industry just to try and compete with WoW?

I understand you don't know the answers. Nonetheless, your opinion is respected. I hope in this case it doesn't come true. If it does, I would abandon 4E completely. The play experience is so different with a screen and keyboard in the way that it isn't worthwhile anymore.

On a related note, please DON'T do something like this with Pathfinder. I am finding more and more to like with Pathfinder the more I look at it, and to consign it to cyberspace in the search for more profits would be truly horrible.

Just one customer's opinion.

I tend to agree here. I haven't been playing lately, but I've been checking out a lot of the Pathfinder stuff, and I really like what's been coming out. Particularly, as Paizo comes out with more "advanced" books beyond the core release, the manners in which they're starting to diverge are really interesting.

I can say that I haven't tried playing online......but honestly, if I'm going to play a game online, it's going to be an MMORPG or my XBox or something....not sitting around talking in a chat session playing a tabletop RPG. And I say that being someone who played D&D for about 20 years. Nothing really compares to getting around a table with some friends to play.

This having been said, I'm noticing a lot of threads lately about the "fate" of D&D. I'm not sure if I've missed something, but have there been announcements that it's going under, or is in trouble or something? I only count about 5 actual products on the release schedule for this year......that seems like what happened right before TSR folded and was acquired by Wizards..I seem to remember that year there were very few products.....or am I thinking of the year before 3E came out?

I never made the changeover myself. 4E just didn't capture me, for whatever reason. But when I look at the message boards here at EN World, at pretty much any time of day, there are like 10 times as many people looking at the 4E forums as there are looking at the Pathfinder forums....though if you tally up all the 3E related forums (including Pathfinder), it seems more like 50/50. I don't think that's a very scientific way of looking at it though I'm not saying any of that to make a value statement. People should play what they enjoy...really, arguing about which is better is pointless.

Hopefully they wouldn't go to a subscription based model where everything is played online.

I wonder though, if this is partly bad timing.....4E came out right at the start of the recession.....I know I was laid off like a month after 4E came out, so I was too busy looking for work to play, and couldn't justify spending money on books for a new system, and I'm curious about how many other players/DM's ended up in a similar situation. I was the DM of our group, so it pretty much imploded when I no longer had time to play.

Banshee