Alter self

[James the Newbie]

This spell alter self confuses me just a little.

The first thing that confuses me is about all polymorph school spells, the HD limit, if you have 6HD, and you become a 5HD creature, does your HD change.

The next one was that it says you cant use your limbs for extra attacks, but if you had wings, or gills, do they function as normal

After this I saw that armour and equipment can meld into you, does this mean you can use the spell to quickly meld whatever your bound by casting alter self? (I assume you can cast the spell via metamagic feats, such as still spell) And after the spell wears off, your position would be to awkward (Arms outstreched and such) for the binding to contain you any more

After this I started to wonder a bit more, if your clothes where on fire, and the equipment melds to you, do you takefire damage, or have you temporarily stopped the problem

Just looking at a level 2 spell, I feel I have misread something, as the point simply seems to disguise ones self, not remove shackles, escape fire, fly and swim at the ocean bed.

 

[Sekhmet]

First: No, you never lose or change hit die when using Alter Self. The limit exists only to prevent a low level caster from using Alter Self to mimic a high level creature's natural abilities. Since you gain the natural attacks, movement, size, and armor of the target, switching into a Deva for their +15 Armor at level 5 would be awesome.

Secondly: You're allowed to use the natural attacks that your new body possesses (claws, bites, tail slaps, etc), that rule exists primarily for individuals who want to say "I'm an 8 armed Drider who wields two great swords in four hands each, so my strength and power attack bonus is quadrupled."

Third: Interesting idea. I'd probably allow it to work.

Four: A temporary fix. It'd be much easier to remove your robe.

Alter Self is one of the best spells a sorcerer or wizard can have in their arsenal.

 

[RUMBLETiGER]

Alter Self.

The first thing that confuses me is about all polymorph school spells, the HD limit, if you have 6HD, and you become a 5HD creature, does your HD change.

You retain your levels and hitpoints, so as I understand it, you'd still be considered having 6HD.

The next one was that it says you cant use your limbs for extra attacks, but if you had wings, or gills, do they function as normal

If the new form has wings you can use them at the form's fly speed. If your original form had wings, and your new form does not, you can no longer fly. If you had a supernatural ability to fly (like from the Waarlock invocation, for example) you'd retain that even if your new form does not fly.
As for breathing with gills, While it doesn't directly list modes of breathing, my understanding is that you assume the mode of breathing of the new form and lose your previous mode of breathing. I understand this from the line, "You acquire the physical qualities of the new form while retaining your own mind" even though it's not on the list. I'd not fight with ba DM that refused this however.

After this I saw that armour and equipment can meld into you, does this mean you can use the spell to quickly meld whatever your bound by casting alter self? (I assume you can cast the spell via metamagic feats, such as still spell) And after the spell wears off, your position would be to awkward (Arms outstreched and such) for the binding to contain you any more

Hm... this is a good question. So if I understand this correctly, you're tied up with rope, Alter Self into another form, (even yourself), and the rope would be absorbed. I think that's how it would work. However, I'd figure when the spell wore off, you'd return to being bound.

After this I started to wonder a bit more, if your clothes where on fire, and the equipment melds to you, do you takefire damage, or have you temporarily stopped the problem

D&D classifies fire as energy damage and not an object, I believe if you were on fire and used Alter Self, you'd still be on fire in your new form.

Just looking at a level 2 spell, I feel I have misread something, as the point simply seems to disguise ones self, not remove shackles, escape fire, fly and swim at the ocean bed.

The spell most definitely as written can provide you with the ability to fly and swim, it says so.
As for removing shackles and escaping fire, I don't think that's what is intended.

 

[Lactantius]

I always wondered what woulb be good staple forms to make use of for different (utility) purposes.

Is there a reliable staple list for good alter self forms without going the cheesy way?

 

[James the Newbie]

[MENTION=6674868]RUMBLETiGER[/MENTION] Thanks for the detailed response, sorry I cant exp you at the moment.

 

[Grand Poobah]

You may be able to slip out of bonds if you changed down a size category. Or you could, if the DM allowed, get a chance to break the bonds if you went a size category larger.

 

[Grand Poobah]

I always wondered what woulb be good staple forms to make use of for different (utility) purposes.

Is there a reliable staple list for good alter self forms without going the cheesy way?

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[Sekhmet]

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Please note that this list is more complete (and better) if you read through the first few pages of comments, unlike other handbooks.
The main entry doesn't cover every possibility if you are not a humanoid race.

 

[Greenfield]

Equipment doesn't automatically meld into you. That only happens if it's something your new form can't wear.

For example, if you were a Halfling and became Human, your Halfling sized clothes wouldn't fit, so they'd meld into you. Your magic rings, however, would resize (as magic rings do), and continue to function.

So you're chained to a wall and you Alter Self from Human to Human. The chains fit the new Human form just as well as they did the old one, so no melding is going to occur. If you could change to a larger form, the cuff part would meld, in my opinion, since each link in a chain can be considered a separate object.

If you were doused in Alchemical Fire and your magical robe was burning, Alter Self won't do you much good, since magical robes resize.

Now presume you're running a Half Dragon. You could change to a Young Adult or Wyrmling Dragon (stay within the 5 dice limit) and that robe will meld in. *AND BECOME INACTIVE*. That's the other part of the "meld" thing: Items melded become inactive. so the robe stops being a robe, and stops burning. At least until the spell goes down.

The Half-Dragon to Dragon transformation is a neat one, and works because they're the same type. That is, Humans, Elves, Orcs, etc. are all listed as Humanoids. Half Dragons are listed as Dragon Types. So, for that matter, are Kobolds!

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

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