Why simpler - much simpler - is better

[Dethklok]

To a certain degree, RPGs are a matter of taste and personal preference. We all know this. But throughout discussions on games with gamers, I almost always find that the attitudes I take for granted are so rare as to be virtually unknown. And most people's typical idea about how much complexity is a good, rarely gets defended, let alone explained to me. So I want to explain my attitude here, and maybe have a discussion about it.

At the front page of ENworld right now, you can see a guy with an animated expression talking about Dungeons and Dragons, insisting that "the game can literally be anything you want," and that "anyone who has ever played in a childhood imagination game like, I dunno a tea party, knows how to play the game."

This should be totally true.

The unfortunate fact is that it's totally wrong.

I don't know anyone else who plays with nothing but a blackboard, chalk, and a d20. I don't find people outside my gaming group who sit down outside with paper and coins and a lantern and just play. They never do. They need books. Not one, but many, books plural, full of instructions to tell them how to use their imaginations. They also need pots of dice, and miniature figures, and character sheets - oh, the character sheets they need. Not character cards, character concepts, character themes, or even character sheets in the singular with each player having one sheet. No we're talking about multiple forms filled in and stapled together like a job application or this year's taxes.

That almost all of you reading this find that kind of thing fun is something I realize. I get it. I do see that it is indeed true that most of you derive pleasure from all these rules and complications. But I want to at least point out that all of this

* is expensive,
* is time consuming to learn about,
* slows your games down,
* limits what you can do, and
* creates confusion.

I play to have an active, immersive, aesthetic, creative experience. I want to be taken away to another place, another time, and explore the beauty, and danger, and terror, and adventure and romance and glory and awe of another world.

For me, that is the whole idea of roleplaying.

And it seems obvious to me that complicated initiative protocols do not facilitate this. Things like mood music, a few candles, and the occasional illustration are what make this work. If you spend all your money, time, and energy on rules, you can't set up any atmosphere - you can't make a game that I want to play.

 

[Whizbang Dustyboots]

To a certain degree, RPGs are a matter of taste and personal preference.

"To a degree?" Are you saying there's some sort of absolute measurable yardstick of RPG goodness that also exists? What unit of measurement does it use? (I vote for "Gygaxes," if it doesn't have a name yet.)

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

If you spend all your money, time, and energy on rules, you can't set up any atmosphere - you can't make a game that I want to play.

It may it work for you, but it definitely works for some.

Immersion doesn't have so much to do with the complexity of the rules than the preparedness & rules familiarity of the players and GM. The more prepared & familiar they are, the fewer times they need to reference the rules duering the game. The fewer times they reference the rules, the more mental energy can be spent on immersion.

For example, I'm a HEROphile. That is my go-to; my #1. Definitely not a rules-lite, simple system. Very crunchy, even.

However, IME, most of the time spent with the HERO rules is when PCs are being created or modified: most of what a player needs to run a game is on his character sheet. Many times, the only person who touches the rulebook is the GM.

And the players in my 1900-era supers game using HERO were as immersed as any players I have ever seen.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

What unit of measurement does it use? (I vote for "Gygaxes," if it doesn't have a name yet.)

Seconded, but with the modification that it be called an "EGG."

 

[Crothian]

I play to have an active, immersive, aesthetic, creative experience. I want to be taken away to another place, another time, and explore the beauty, and danger, and terror, and adventure and romance and glory and awe of another world.

For me, that is the whole idea of roleplaying.

And it seems obvious to me that complicated initiative protocols do not facilitate this. Things like mood music, a few candles, and the occasional illustration are what make this work. If you spend all your money, time, and energy on rules, you can't set up any atmosphere - you can't make a game that I want to play.

Not everyone wants that though. So, what works for you and it is great you know what you want does not work for everyone. For instance the ideas of candles makes me laugh. It looks cheesy and either you have candles in a bright room and they look silly or people try to dim the light and make it hard for people to see which is important to me because my eyesight is really bad. Maybe you would like LARP?

 

[Derren]

I play to have an active, immersive, aesthetic, creative experience. I want to be taken away to another place, another time, and explore the beauty, and danger, and terror, and adventure and romance and glory and awe of another world.

For me, that is the whole idea of roleplaying.

And it is even better when what happens in this world depends on who your character is (in form of rules and abilities) instead of what the DM things would make a good story, no matter how silly it is what happens (for when there are no rules and everything depends on DM decisions).

 

[GMMichael]

At the front page of ENworld right now, you can see a guy with an animated expression talking about Dungeons and Dragons, insisting that "the game can literally be anything you want," and that "anyone who has ever played in a childhood imagination game like, I dunno a tea party, knows how to play the game."

This should be totally true.

The unfortunate fact is that it's totally wrong.
. . .
That almost all of you reading this find that kind of thing fun is something I realize. I get it. I do see that it is indeed true that most of you derive pleasure from all these rules and complications. But I want to at least point out that all of this

* is expensive,
* is time consuming to learn about,
* slows your games down,
* limits what you can do, and
* creates confusion.

I play to have an active, immersive, aesthetic, creative experience. . . For me, that is the whole idea of roleplaying.

Yeah, I couldn't watch too much of that video. It turned into an advertisement too fast. And you're right, D&D is waaaaaaay more complex than childhood imagination games.

RPG gear is expensive, yes. Time consuming: some might call that "pleasure reading." It doesn't have to slow games down if the game master lives up to his name. I wouldn't always call it limiting, either, because if players have conflicting ideas of what they want to do, it might be called "balancing" instead. Further, some extra rules can act as imagination stimulation, which isn't limiting. And does more gear create confusion? In the case of GURPS, I'd give that a pretty big "yes."

When your game is much simpler, you run the risk of having accusations of arbitrary GM decisions - have fun checking out THAT forum thread. Also, a professional is less likely to commit himself to a small, simple project (lower paycheck compared to the transition costs), so don't expect too many commercial-grade, simple RPGs. For me, and probably yourself, that's no biggie. We can imagine or draw up what we need without the commercial experience.

So I'm not sold on simpler being better yet. Unless you want to be more specific with that assertion.

 

[Yora]

For my current campaign, I got two pdfs for Castles & Crusades (though Basic Fantasy is almost the same and free), every player has a single page character sheet, and needs 5 dice. Which most of them don't have, so we're sharing those that we got. None of them played the game before, so I taught them in 30 minutes.

To use the cliched expression: "Your argument is invalid".

Simple RPGs do exist and are easily and cheaply available. Anyone who plays with lots of books and owns 50 dice chose to do so.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

To use the cliched expression: "Your argument is invalid".

Whose?

Simple RPGs do exist and are easily and cheaply available.

Yes. I have a couple that are quite fun and make C&C look ponderous.

Anyone who plays with lots of books and owns 50 dice chose to do so.

And probably for a reason.

 

[Morrus]

There have been times in my life when I have derived immense amounts of pleasure from hours of complex rules-heavy tinkering and optimization - of characters, spaceships, all sorts of things.

I certainly enjoy a fast, rules-light game. But complex tactical stuff has its own pleasures, and should not be disregarded. There's a market for both.