D&D 5E Can you see when you're Blinded?

[KarinsDad]

PHB. Pg 204: "To target something, you must have a clear path to it, so it can’t be behind total cover."

You don't need need to see a target in order to target it. Only hear it. If you can't see or hear it, you need to guess where it is.

See "Unseen attackers and targets" page 194, which I quoted earlier.

An NPC attacker with a bow up in a tree.

PCs cast Fog Cloud.

Since they knew where the NPC was before Fog Cloud was cast, are they guessing when they can no longer see the terrain around them? Can they just fire their bows with disadvantage and automatically not guess where he is?

This actually came up in our game. It seems a bit much that someone could target the exact square that a foe is in, even though they cannot see that square (in our game, hex). Our DM actually came up with a house rule for it later on.

 

[Hussar]

An NPC attacker with a bow up in a tree.

PCs cast Fog Cloud.

Since they knew where the NPC was before Fog Cloud was cast, are they guessing when they can no longer see the terrain around them? Can they just fire their bows with disadvantage and automatically not guess where he is?

This actually came up in our game. It seems a bit much that someone could target the exact square that a foe is in, even though they cannot see that square (in our game, hex). Our DM actually came up with a house rule for it later on.

Yeah, I gotta agree with this. This seems pretty wonky. Fighting at night gets a whole lot easier for those who can't see in the dark if I can target any target and only suffer disadvantage.

Oh, and btw, oooooh, hexes, cool.

 

[Mr Fixit]

Oh, and btw, oooooh, hexes, cool.

I grew up on those! Hexes for the win!

 

[KarinsDad]

Yeah, I gotta agree with this. This seems pretty wonky. Fighting at night gets a whole lot easier for those who can't see in the dark if I can target any target and only suffer disadvantage.

The house rule (with hexes) was a D8 roll. On a 1 or 2, it's the proper hex (25%), on a 3 to 8, it's one of the adjacent hexes (each number corresponds to a different hex). This does allow for firing into a crowd that cannot be seen (in the dark for example). But yeah, a 80% chance to hit an AC 10 foe drops to 64% chance with disadvantage drops to 16% chance with the house rule. It works for the NPCs as well, though. Firing into that Fog Cloud, pick a hex. You might not hit it, but you might instead hit an adjacent hex where an unintended target PC actually is. I could see upping this to a D10 though (which would up the chances in this example to 25.6%).

 

[Olaf the Stout]

The logic used by this group makes my head hurt.

 

[TDarien]

An NPC attacker with a bow up in a tree.

PCs cast Fog Cloud.

Since they knew where the NPC was before Fog Cloud was cast, are they guessing when they can no longer see the terrain around them? Can they just fire their bows with disadvantage and automatically not guess where he is?

This actually came up in our game. It seems a bit much that someone could target the exact square that a foe is in, even though they cannot see that square (in our game, hex). Our DM actually came up with a house rule for it later on.

Yes. Disadvantage is a pretty substantial penalty. If you can hear a creature you can locate it well enough to attack it without having to guess where it is.

The issue is that if you do it differently, then hiding has no purpose. You'll get all the advantages of being hidden without having to make a stealth check. Which, in 5e, costs an action in combat.

The rules for unseen targets lay it out well. Either you can hear a target you can't see, or you have to guess its location (I quoted the exact text earlier). This strongly implies you don't have to guess the location of a target you can hear.

 

[Thank Dog]

I think I've just come up with a neat way to deal with it. You attack with disadvantage, that's a given. If the attack misses the target, then use the highest result on the two d20 rolls to determine if the attack hits a random target adjacent to the intended target, friend or foe

 

[KarinsDad]

Yes. Disadvantage is a pretty substantial penalty. If you can hear a creature you can locate it well enough to attack it without having to guess where it is.

Disadvantage is about -4 to -5 to hit, but it is weird to be able to get anywhere near a target 100 feet away that you cannot see (or hear for that matter, it's not like an enemy archer at 100 or 200 feet away is shouting).

The 60% to 80% chance of hitting most foes (AC dependent) drops to 36% to 64%. Those are really good odds. That's not a real substantial drop based on what we are talking about.

I totally get that if you can see the tree that you are aiming for and there is an invisible foe there, but if you are blind, your odds of hitting anything at 100 feet should basically be maybe 1% tops. Your odds of firing in the wrong direction and missing your mark by 10 feet or more should be fairly high.

 

[Nebulous]

I just saw this thread. I'm not reading the whole thing, but GOOD LORD. What kind of people do you play with? How old are they and do they have any gaming experience, OR are they handicapped slightly??

 

[Beleriphon]

Do the players remember that being Blinded means that other creatures are now functionally invisible to them? Its effectively the reverse description of the invisible condition.