D&D 5E What Rules do you see people mistake or misapply?

[Valdier]

Well, then you should have no problems with the Elf still needing a full 8 hours to get the benefit of a Full Rest as is in the rules.

Except it isn't

The fact that you quoted what I said, then linked to the point I made as a way of stating your stance, didn't change that I still said "it's sage advice, not RAW".

Starts with first convincing you that the rule he wants is has no mechanical benefit and then abuses it constantly later.

I'm sorry you have trouble with your players/game this way. Still RAW.

It would very much benefit a player if the DM has a tendency to interrupt the Long Rests after the half way mark.

Agreed, and had you read the rest of the discussion, you likely would have seen me say it's "simply arbitrary". It is 100% a story/RP ability, and only comes in helpful when the DM says it does... like when they decide "yes, you can get a long rest" or... "no, I only want the elves to recover for this specific piece of the adventure/story, so you get 4 hours before something happens". It isn't a +1 to hit, it's a story benefit and only needing 4 hours *is* RAW. Sage advice changes RAW to be RAI, because that *definitely* is not in the book (and in fact contradicts 100% what is *actually* written) [After resting in this way, you gain the same benefit that a human does from 8 hours of sleep].

It's *exactly* what I have been saying, but play it how you want to, and what works for your table.

 

[Pathkeeper24601]

Except it isn't

The fact that you quoted what I said, then linked to the point I made as a way of stating your stance, didn't change that I still said "it's sage advice, not RAW".



I'm sorry you have trouble with your players/game this way. Still RAW.



Agreed, and had you read the rest of the discussion, you likely would have seen me say it's "simply arbitrary". It is 100% a story/RP ability, and only comes in helpful when the DM says it does... like when they decide "yes, you can get a long rest" or... "no, I only want the elves to recover for this specific piece of the adventure/story, so you get 4 hours before something happens". It isn't a +1 to hit, it's a story benefit and only needing 4 hours *is* RAW. Sage advice changes RAW to be RAI, because that *definitely* is not in the book (and in fact contradicts 100% what is *actually* written) [After resting in this way, you gain the same benefit that a human does from 8 hours of sleep].

It's *exactly* what I have been saying, but play it how you want to, and what works for your table.

Now you just need to find the Rule that says sleep is equal to a long rest. Note that there has been a discussion that would indicate one does not need to sleep to get the benefit of a long rest. I know a DM that interprets this to mean non-elves need 8 hours of sleep to avoid exhaustion and effectively turns a long rest into 10+ hours. He insists this is RAW since the elves avoid exhaustion with 4 hours of trance while the others need 8 to avoid exhaustion.

I see the game as more than just combat, so saying it doesn't provide a combat advantage isn't really all that convincing to me. If you don't call that RAW, then that is up to you. I would rather go with a well documented RAI than some posters interpretation of what they think RAW should be.

 

[Oofta]

That's silly but until it makes errata I'll use my interp.

When it comes to casting a spell through a window (or any other obstruction) I think this is an area where it might make sense for an AL organizer to have a list of "This is how we run things" in addition to "Rules Clarifications".

I think saying that a window stops a spell makes the most sense and is most consistent. Would you allow a fireball to be cast through a window? What about a ranged attack like scorching ray? Then you get other cases like lightning bolt. Would it go through? Break the glass? What if it's a wall of force instead of glass?

Easiest to just say it doesn't pass through any obstruction, which is the way I've always run it.

I do wish it would be added to the sage advice compendium though, and feel free to run it the way it makes sense to you. Just try to be consistent, if you can figure out what that is.

 

[Pathkeeper24601]

I'm sorry you have trouble with your players/game this way. Still RAW.

Since they never have brought this up as an issue, I assume they came to the same understanding I have without the benefit of my ruling. They make use of the elven trance to set their watches for the long rest, but they end up recovering their resources at the same time as everybody else. Usually, this is the kind of issue that only shows up online where people are trying to drive the direction of the game with their own opinion on how RAW should be interpreted.

 

[Valdier]

I had a player that always debated this way. Starts with first convincing you that the rule he wants is has no mechanical benefit and then abuses it constantly later.

Since they never have brought this up as an issue, I assume they came to the same understanding I have without the benefit of my ruling

Oh, I apologize. I thought when you said you had a player that always debated this way, you were talking about something relevant to the conversation. I didn't realize you were talking about a fictitious situation in which this never happened, and isn't actually a problem.

Usually, this is the kind of issue that only shows up online where people are trying to drive the direction of the game with their own opinion on how RAW should be interpreted.

Or people who actually play by RAW. That being, whats actually written in the book. Interpretation is what the Sage did in the article. 8 hours of sleep, is a fulfillment clause of a long rest (barring some special circumstance). I get that you want to play by the Sage's ruling, and that is fine. But that *doesn't* mean people that play by RAW, are applying the rules wrong, which is what this thread is about.

A long rest is a period of extended downtime, at least 8 hours long, during which a character sleeps or performs light activity

Trance: After resting in this way, you gain the same benefit that a human does from 8 hours of sleep

 

[Ketser]

I think this has finally vanished, but for a long time a lot of people (among them people creating classes and warlock patrons on DMs guild) assumed that warlock patron spells work like domain/land/oath spells, instead of just beinga dditional spell options to choose from.

 

[The Crimson Binome]

I choose all that before the adventurers ever got there.
Interpretation only happens at the end.

Interpretation is what happens during the game. Everything else is pre-game, and it's unlikely that all of your expectations will hold up after the game actually starts.

You might guess what lighting conditions the party will end up fighting under, or whether a particular trap will be in effect at that time, but you have no way of knowing whether it will actually remain the case when (or if) the time comes. Maybe the players will do something different.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

6. If you roll for wealth, you do not get the items from your background.

7. Backgrounds are completely customizable. By the default rules, players do not need a DM's permission to change a background's proficiencies.

I've only seen 6 as a conscious decision, and 7 is nearly impossible to convince some DMs of, no matter how explicit the PHB is.

Bonus action to drink a potion is one that I've seen come up a fair bit.

Active houserule in most cases I've seen it. Are you really seeing people claim it's RAW?

Rogues and monks can dash twice.

The game is balanced around 6-8 encounters per day.

And take a regular movement! or move, super jump, dash! It's pretty great.
The encounter one seems like a built in guidepost, not an actual rule, to me.

Acting on player knowledge not character knowledge. Example (from HotDQ):
My character sees the Rogue open a treasure chest, get a face-full of dust, run away screaming wildly, and jump in a lake.
My player knows the Rogue is hallucinating, is trying to swim down to the bottom of the lake, and is going to drown.
Can / should I jump in after and save the Rogue?

Casting a spell when you can't aim it properly (around corner / no line-of-sight, overhead at flying foe, through keyhole, terrain provides cover/concealment/both from each other)

Some of these seems strange, and about rulings rather than the rules as written.

WHy would the drowning rogue's ally need anything other than what they've seen to jump in after the rogue? At most I could see requiring an Insight check, and even then only if the rogue is prone to wild gesticulation and random actions...but still, the other character saw the powder fly in his face, saw him yelling and panicking, and them jump into a lake.
If I saw that IRL, I'd jump in after my friend, after telling someone to call emergency services. If I weren't a good swimmer, I'd call and yell at the nearest fit person to jump in and get him. Obviously something is very wrong. Metagaming also isn't mentioned at all in the rules, so it's off topic.

Also, why would you not be able to cast a spell at a creature flying overhead? As for keyholes, if they're old fashioned enough...yeah, makes sense. At most I'd impose disadvantage.

To be fair, that's not at all clear without the Sage Advice ruling. Drinking a flask of water is absolutely covered by the Use an Object action, so it's perfectly natural to assume that drinking a potion of healing should be no different. There's certainly no in-game reason for that to be the case, and, frankly, given the power level of potions in the game it's really not a restriction that I would consider beneficial to retain. It's not at all clear that the individual rules for each magic item type or each individual magic item description are providing explicit exceptions to the normal combat action rules. If Mearls and Crawford had wanted the game to work this way, they should have added a Use a Magic Item action to the list in the PHB.

Until we got the DMG, I was doing this. After that, I houseruled it. I also allowed the tinkerer in the current campaign to make potion flasks that have easily popped off stoppers, with a flick of the thumb, so anyone can drink a potion quickly, and Rogues can do it as part of another action.

Mostly, I see stuff with the action economy, and people assuming spells work like they did in past editions.
And my group uses knowledge skills like they were in 4e, but I encourage that.

 

[Pathkeeper24601]

Or people who actually play by RAW. That being, whats actually written in the book. Interpretation is what the Sage did in the article. 8 hours of sleep, is a fulfillment clause of a long rest (barring some special circumstance). I get that you want to play by the Sage's ruling, and that is fine. But that *doesn't* mean people that play by RAW, are applying the rules wrong, which is what this thread is about.

RAW really isn't a strong a case in 5th as previous versions. Notice how a podcast by Crawford changes the whole discussion on what is RAW (or RAI if you must) about Perception, Invisibility, and Hiding. To dismiss such RAI because you don't like the results also weakens the case for such articles/podcasts provided by WotC that benefit to other players.

Thanks for providing the definitions of Trance and Long Rest. I see how Sleep is a possible activity of a Long Rest and Trance modifies that one part of it, but I still don't see where Sleep == Long Rest (Long Rest -> Sleep does not mean Sleep -> Long Rest). You can certainly have a long rest without any Sleep (or be in a Trance). If that happens, does the Elf now need the full 8 hours? You can sleep/be in a trance at other parts of the day without gaining the advantage of a long rest [if you already had one within 24 hours]. This certainly lends a certain amount of interpretation to what is perceived as RAW. I would lend more credence to saying neither ruling is RAW, but closer to RAI(ntrepreted).

 

[Warmaster Horus]

Total cover =/= total concealment

The creature has total cover: there is an obstacle fully between them.
The creature doesn't have concealment: the cover is transparent.

I agree. It's the PH that makes the cover = concealment arrangement. A target has total cover if it is completely concealed by an obstacle. In any case why would a thin layer of glass provide any protection from a spell or other attack beyond something very ephemeral?