D&D 5E Xanathar's Healing Spirit is 10d6 healing to the whole party out of combat?

[The Crimson Binome]

All that means nothing if you consider prayer of healing as underpowered which was the very first premise of my last post.

So you're ignoring Prayer of Healing as a reference point, because you think it's poorly designed? Okay, sure. There are plenty of spells in this edition that are poorly designed and should be ignored, so let's pretend that this is one of them.

That leaves our only reference point as Cure Wounds II, which heals 13 points over the course of one round.

Healing Spirit (as written) heals up to 210 points over the course of ten rounds. Even if it only lasts for one round, that's still 6d6 healing, so right off the bat it's already overpowered for out-of-combat healing when compared to Cure Wounds. But then it keeps going, maintaining that effect for ten rounds. It has better throughput with its one spell slot than if you had spent ten spell slots on Cure Wounds. It is very obviously ridiculously overpowered, in comparison to the only alternative.

Healing Spirit (limited to once per round) heals 35 points over the course of ten rounds. It has 2-3 times as much healing as Cure Wounds II, but you can divide it in 1d6 increments to be more efficient, and it takes ten times as long to achieve the effect. That's definitely a tradeoff, so it's not obvious that it's ridiculously overpowered. That version could be balanced, if you're ever in a situation where you aren't sure if you have a full minute before someone breaks down the door. Is that something that happens to people? Because if you can spare a minute safely, then it's right back to being ridiculously overpowered compared to the alternative.

 

[The Crimson Binome]

Prayer of healing is not a strong spell. It's weak. Borderline bad.

Just for the record, I'm going down as saying that Prayer of Healing is a very strong spell. It's borderline overpowered. I'm honestly not sure why you would think otherwise, unless the casting time just makes it completely unusable in the sorts of situations you find yourself in (which is fair, YMMV, etc).

 

[Zmajdusa]

Spells that allow short and long rests would be a better comparison, Leomunds tiny hut is a 3rd level spell, allows for a uninterrupted long rest, rope trick is a 2nd level spell that pretty much allows for a short rest. Leomunds hut is a 1 minute casting time, and can be cast as a ritual. Rope Trick is simply one action casting time. Compared to those 2 spells, Prayer of Healing seems weak to me. Prayer of Healing just restores hit points, while the other 2 can allow recovery of hit points, recovery of class resources, and the use of class abilities that occur at the end or during a short/long rest.

 

[5ekyu]

Prayer of healing is not a strong spell. It's weak. Borderline bad.

Bad means by comparison. As it has according to you no other to compare to at its lwvel for out of combat healing, it seems an odd conckusion to reach as such an absolute certainty.

Others have noted its strength compared to the in combat cures.

Its cast time pits it at 1\6 the short rest for big healing, seems good, not weak.

Even compared to goodberry...
Goodberry 10 hp per slot 1.
Goodberry+life 40hp per slot-1

Prayer assume +3 Modifier and 4-6 char
Prayer avg 48-72 depending on how many pcs.
Prayer+life 64-96 depending on whether 4-6 pcs.

Only reason goodberry even in the running is the life multiclass which tends to favor the lower spells.

So all in all its numbers seem pretty ok for tier-1 group healing spell and its casting time cuts a lot off short rest time which only allows you to expend your multi-days to recover HP.

Please show me the weak to bad supporting case? Or is it that it has to be because that is needed to make your case?

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[FrogReaver]

Just for the record, I'm going down as saying that Prayer of Healing is a very strong spell. It's borderline overpowered. I'm honestly not sure why you would think otherwise, unless the casting time just makes it completely unusable in the sorts of situations you find yourself in (which is fair, YMMV, etc).

And there's the breakdown.

just currious, how often do you actually see prayer of healing used in your games? Once per day? Less than once per day. 2 time per day? More than 2 times per day?

 

[FrogReaver]

Remember the whole impact on game thing?

Bad means by comparison. As it has according to you no other to compare to at its lwvel for out of combat healing, it seems an odd conckusion to reach as such an absolute certainty.

Others have noted its strength compared to the in combat cures.

Its cast time pits it at 1\6 the short rest for big healing, seems good, not weak.

Even compared to goodberry...
Goodberry 10 hp per slot 1.
Goodberry+life 40hp per slot-1

Prayer assume +3 Modifier and 4-6 char
Prayer avg 48-72 depending on how many pcs.
Prayer+life 64-96 depending on whether 4-6 pcs.

Only reason goodberry even in the running is the life multiclass which tends to favor the lower spells.

So all in all its numbers seem pretty ok for tier-1 group healing spell and its casting time cuts a lot off short rest time which only allows you to expend your multi-days to recover HP.

Please show me the weak to bad supporting case? Or is it that it has to be because that is needed to make your case?

Sent from my [device_name] using EN World mobile app

 

[Ovinomancer]

Remember the whole impact on game thing?

Are we back to you insisting 1 minute is the same as 10 is the same as 60?

 

[Stalker0]

I think something we really have not considered here:

Prayer of Healing is a Cleric Spell; Healing Spirit is a Druid spell.

Just as wizards get stronger blasting spells than clerics, maybe its okay for druid's to have better out of combat healing. You could argue "regenerative" type abilities are well within the druid's wheelhouse, and its not like cleric's are slouches in this department.

 

[Ovinomancer]

I think something we really have not considered here:

Prayer of Healing is a Cleric Spell; Healing Spirit is a Druid spell.

Just as wizards get stronger blasting spells than clerics, maybe its okay for druid's to have better out of combat healing. You could argue "regenerative" type abilities are well within the druid's wheelhouse, and its not like cleric's are slouches in this department.

That's not exactly a theme that was well established (or at all established) before this spell, and HS would be the only example of such a theme. Not sure you should extrapolate from one, arguably poorly designed, data point into an entire theme. I like post facto justification as much as the next DM, but not sure it works here.

 

[FrogReaver]

Are we back to you insisting 1 minute is the same as 10 is the same as 60?

Do you still beat your wife?