You've Created A Bad Character. How, why and whose fault is it?

[Wofano Wotanto]

Yeah, I have a character that could easily dominate the game I'm in and I intentionally handicap him periodically, because I don't want the campaign to devolve into me and my sidekicks, which would be a crappy thing to do to my friends.

I hear that. You want to pull your own weight, not crush everyone else under it.

 

[Tonguez]

Too many options and trap options are definitely the fault of the games Class based design and DnD is particularly egregious in that regard.

But generally any concept including intentionally weaker options can be fun, and fun makes all things good

 

[Reynard]

Yeah, I have a character that could easily dominate the game I'm in and I intentionally handicap him periodically, because I don't want the campaign to devolve into me and my sidekicks, which would be a crappy thing to do to my friends.

Out of curiosity, have you talked to the other players about this? What if they liked the idea of a "Buffy and the Scoobs" dynamic?

 

[MichaelSomething]

My nephew wanted to try playing a bard in our 3.5 game, and after 6 levels decided bards are boring to play - he spent most of his time using "inspire courage" to boost the other PCs' attacks, so they got to do the cool stuff while he just pretty much strummed his lute round after round. So he started taking rogue levels from that point on, and I gave him a magic sword that allowed him to "catch up to where he would have been" on the sneak attack damage front, at least. And he now he's a sneak attack powerhouse and has a bard NPC girlfriend who handles the "inspire courage" class feature the other PCs have all gotten used to.

So, to him, his bard 6 was an unintentional bad PC, but his bard 6/rogue 9 (and counting) PC is much better.

Johnathan

While it does cost a turn to start inspire courage, maintaining it is a free action. So a bard can still move and make melee attacks while inspiring.

And a bard is still a capable spellcaster. Even beyond their own spell list, they had use magic device in class and a high Cha. They do have access to every low level spell via scrolls.

Bards can be very effective. Though I do admit having the first two rounds of every combat being inspire courage followed by haste can become boring for some.

 

[MGibster]

The more interesting question for me is "Who is responsible?"

I'm going to give you a cop out answer and say it's a shared responsibility. Cyberpunk 2020 had a slew of skills including Accounting, Anthropology, Geology, History, and Stock Market that weren't ever going to be used in your typical Cyberpunk game. Sure, I can assign a little blame to the player who made an assassin and decided to give his character Stock Market, but having these skills kind of invites people to fall into those traps.

In Call of Cthulhu, a character might use Charm, Credit Rating, Fast Talk, Persuade, or even Intimidation to accomplish similar goals. In this particular case, I'm going to put the blame on the authors' of the game itself. Having so many skills that are similar is an odd choice in a game where someone with a History skill of 65% is applicable to all all eras/cultures. That's right, if you have a 65% History you're just as good at Ancient Roman history as your are 1930s Chinese, 18th century American Whaling, or Babylonian history. A CoC player might very well be confused as to when it's more appropriate to use Fast Talk than it is Charm. And the Keeper (GM) might have trouble as well. This is a problem with the rules I think not the players.

It is possible for a player to create a "bad character" in most games. Here, we will define bad as "doesn't work with the intended method and focus of play" and leave it at that.

I think this is probably the best definition of a bad character.

 

[Richards]

While it does cost a turn to start inspire courage, maintaining it is a free action. So a bard can still move and make melee attacks while inspiring.

And a bard is still a capable spellcaster. Even beyond their own spell list, they had use magic device in class and a high Cha. They do have access to every low level spell via scrolls.

Bards can be very effective. Though I do admit having the first two rounds of every combat being inspire courage followed by haste can become boring for some.

Agreed - but my nephew got pretty bored running a bard nonetheless. It's a fine class for those who like that sort of thing, but he's not among their number.

Johnathan

 

[R_J_K75]

Person that created it

 

[CleverNickName]

Person that created it

I feel like I'm at my most American whenever I screw up and then say "Actually this is all someone else's fault."

 

[billd91]

1. Intentional Traps: This is less common that it once was, but not gone. Sometimes designers decide they should include bad choices in characters creation/advancement, just to catch the newbs and "reward system mastery." (Looking at you, Monte.)

2. Too many options: This is the same as above, but without the intentionality. there are just lots of options, and not all of them are good, and some explicitly bad, but not because the designers intended it. Maybe they just weren't good at their jobs, or there are so many moving parts it is impossible to know until the game is in the wild.

3. Player unfamiliarity: This is probably the most common result. The player just doesn't know what works and what is good and picks stuff because it sounds like the thing they want to do.

4. Player intentionality: the player knows something is suboptimal or even bad, and picks it anyway -- probably because it fits their intended theme and character fantasy.

With all of these, the GM has to bear some of the responsibility because they’re failed to help their players create a successful PC in the game they are running. Now, this could be because the DM has chosen a way to run the game in a way that devalues some elements of the game. This is OK, but they should be steering PCs away from options that will be irrelevant. Or they should be looking at their players’ choices and finding ways to incorporate them. The half-ogre barbarian takes Profession: Cook in the 3e/PF game you’re running? Dissuade them from doing it or, better, INCORPORATE IT.

 

[MichaelSomething]

Agreed - but my nephew got pretty bored running a bard nonetheless. It's a fine class for those who like that sort of thing, but he's not among their number.

Johnathan

Now to bring it back to the topic, can we blame someone for it??

Is your nephew to blame for not understanding what a bard is? Though we can't fault him for being a newbie who just picks a thing cause it seems cool at first glance.
Your fault for not interceding earlier? I'm imagine you wouldn't want to limit your nephew choice, and you did plaster over the situation once it became apparent.
The system's fault? Well when they did try to explain how classes work like in 4E lots of people rejected it. So vague class descriptions are a thing that will keep on happening.