D&D 3E/3.5 BoVD 3.5e: Hellbound!

the Lorax

First Post
Weeeeeeeelllll.... I don't think that's entirely true. "Caster level 5" leaves the door open to Warlocks, Bards, Battle Sorcerers (an excellent variant) Fighter/Sorcerers, Hexblades, etc. -- much like the Dragon Disciple, it's a Fighter PrC with an arcane spellcaster pre-req.
Dragon Disciples are balanced around ONE level of Sorcerer thrown in to a Fighter or Paladin build. This PrC is not quite Paladin-ready, but otherwise I'd ask that it be rated against the Dragon Disciple rather than a caster-oriented PrC.

Fair enough - I'm not much of a fan of Dragon Disciple, but I suppose as a low-level-caster-mainly-fighter type of character it can work. I was more pointing out that 5 levels of your revised version + 5 levels of Wizard would be worse than 10 levels of the origninal class which isn't all that strong to begin with.

I really think that a revised Thrall of Grazzt should be open to Warlocks and to traditional Grazzt followers like succubi, lamia and mariliths.
 

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Nifft

Penguin Herder
Thrall of Grazzt -- First Draft

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Thrall of Grazzt

Role: Charming Face of Darkness

Prerequisites:
Alignment: Chaotic Evil
Skill Ranks: Bluff 4+, Diplomacy 4+, Sense Motive 4+, Knowlege(Arcana) 8+
Feats: Demonic Thrall and any two of the following: Violate Spell, Violate Spell-Like Ability, Corrupt Spell, Corrupt Spell-Like Ability, Persuasive, Spell Focus (Enchantment), or Mortalbane
Spells or Spell-Like Abilities: Caster level 5th
Special: Must sacrifice a former lover while an Incubus or Succubus watches.

Benefits:
HD: d6
BAB: 1/2 (as Wizard)
Good Save: Will
Skill Points: 6 + Int bonus
Class Skills: Appraise (Int), Bluff (Cha), Concentration (Con), Craft (Int), Diplomacy (Cha), Escape Artist (Dex), Forgery (Int), Gather Information (Cha), Hide (Dex), Intimidate (Cha), Knowlege (any) (Int), Listen (Wis), Move Silently (Dex), Search (Int), Sense Motive (Wis), Spellcraft (Int), Spot (Wis), Tumble (Dex), Use Magic Device (Cha) and Use Rope (Dex).


Code:
[u]Level   BAB	Fort	Ref	Will	Spellcasting	Special Abilities[/u]
1	+0	+0	+0	+2	--		Charm, Lore
2	+1	+0	+0	+3	+1 Level	Dark Charisma
3	+1	+1	+1	+3	+1 Level	Sneak Attack +1d6
4	+2	+1	+1	+4	+1 Level	[i]Undetectable Alignment[/i] 1/day
5	+2	+1	+1	+4	+1 Level	Draining Enchantment
6	+3	+2	+2	+5	--		Sneak Attack +2d6
7	+3	+2	+2	+5	+1 Level	[i]Commune[/i] 1/day
8	+4	+2	+2	+6	+1 Level	Penetrating Charm
9	+4	+3	+3	+6	+1 Level	Sneak Attack +3d6
10      +5	+3	+3	+7	+1 Level	Touch of Darkness

Special Abilities:
  • Charm: You gain access to the spell Charm Person. What this means depends on your previous spellcasting class:
    - Bard or Sorcerer: You gain charm person as a bonus 1st level spell known. If you already know charm person, you may use your class ability to trade out your previous charm person for any other 1st level spell. You cannot trade out this bonus charm person.
    - Warlock: You learn the charm lesser invocation. If you already knew this invocation, you may immediately choose a new lesser invocation. You may never trade out charm.
    - Wizard: You may spontaneously convert prepared 1st level spells into charm person.
    - Monster (with spell-like abilities): If you already have a charm (person or monster) as a spell-like ability, you gain a +2 bonus to its save DC. Otherwise, you gain charm person as a spell-like ability, usable at will. The DC for this ability is Charisma based.
  • Lore: As the Loremaster class ability.
  • Dark Charisma (Su): You gain a bonus to all Charisma checks (including skill checks) equal to half your Thrall class level. This bonus also adds to your Leadership score, if applicable.
  • Sneak Attack: As the Rogue class ability.
  • Undetectable Alignment (Sp): 1/day, caster level = total hit dice.
  • Draining Enchantment (Su): Any target who fails a Will save against the Thrall's enchantment spell or spell-like ability suffers one point of Wisdom damage in addition to the spell or spell-like ability's normal effect.
  • Commune (Sp): 1/day, caster level = Thrall level, no XP cost so long as the entity questioned is Grazzt or one of his agents.
  • Penetrating Charm (Su): All of your spells and spell-like abilities with the [Charm] descriptor gain +4 to any caster level check (such as to penetrate spell resistance).
  • Touch of Darkness (Su): Any spell, spell-like ability, or special attack that deals ability damage will deal an additional point of ability damage (note that this improves Draining Enchantment class ability to inflict two points of Wisdom damage). For example, Touch of Idiocy cast by a Sor5/ToGrazzt10 would inflict 1d6+1 Int, 1d6+2 Wis, and 1d6+1 Cha damage on a failed save.
    Furthermore, if you inflict one or more negative levels on a foe, you additionally inflict 2 points of Wisdom damage.

-- N
 
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Nifft

Penguin Herder
I think the Grazzty Bebe needs a little something extra at 7th & 8th level -- any ideas? Very minor I'm thinking.

Thanks, -- N
 

the Lorax

First Post
Nifft said:
Thrall of Grazzt

Prerequisites:
Alignment: Chaotic Evil
Skill Ranks: Bluff 4+, Diplomacy 4+, Sense Motive 4+, Knowlege(Arcana) 8+
Feats: Abyssal Thrall and any two of the following: Violate Spell, Violate Spell-Like Ability, Corrupt Spell, Corrupt Spell-Like Ability, Persuasive, Spell Focus (Enchantment), or Mortalbane
Spells or Spell-Like Abilities: Caster level 5th
Special: Must sacrifice a former lover while an Incubus or Succubus watches.

These requirements make sure that only a human bard will qualify at 5th level, not terrible, but it seems a bit much. It is unfortuneate that Feats like Abyssal Thrall/Thrall to Demon require a feat slot. I think that a sacrifice of XPs might be more appropriate...

Nifft said:
Code:
[u]Level   BAB	Fort	Ref	Will	Spellcasting	Special Abilities[/u]
1	+0	+0	+0	+2	--		Charm, Lore
2	+1	+0	+0	+3	+1 Level	Dark Charisma
3	+1	+1	+1	+3	+1 Level	Sneak Attack +1d6
4	+2	+1	+1	+4	+1 Level	
5	+2	+1	+1	+4	+1 Level	Draining Enchantment
6	+3	+2	+2	+5	--		Sneak Attack +2d6
7	+3	+2	+2	+5	+1 Level	
8	+4	+2	+2	+6	+1 Level	
9	+4	+3	+3	+6	+1 Level	Sneak Attack +3d6
10      +5	+3	+3	+7	+1 Level	Touch of Darkness

Nifft said:
Special Abilities:

[*]Charm:
As written, the Charm ability is cumbersome. Also you left out Cleric/Druid/Assassin (not to mention other non-core spell casters. It is nice to basically give the Worlock an extra invocation, but it meshes poorly with other classes.
Nifft said:
[*]Lore:
[*]Dark Charisma (Su):
[*]Sneak Attack:
Works fine, Id almost be tempted to change Dark Charisma to an actual Charisma gain (inherent bonus), but that may be a bit too strong.
Nifft said:
[*]Draining Enchantment (Su):
[*]Touch of Darkness (Su):
Nice, especially if you are a Lamia/Succubi/Worlock.

7th and 8th?

I'd of been happy to write the whole thing up, the least I can do is help! ;)

I'm going to assume that the original's summon demon ability is too much,
so here goes...

Summon Shadow (Su): At 7th level the Thrall can summon a Shadow, This ability works like the Shadow Dancer ability of the same name. The shadow gains an additional 2HD at 10th level.
Dark Bargin(Su): At 8th level the Thrall may cast Commune 1/day with a caster level equal to the Thrall's class level. The Thrall may also use this ability to make requests of Graz'zt, which may be heard or ignored at his option.
 

Nifft

Penguin Herder
the Lorax said:
These requirements make sure that only a human bard will qualify at 5th level, not terrible, but it seems a bit much.

Any Human arcane spellcaster could qualify by the end of 5th level -- the "cross class" social skill pre-reqs are low rank. :)



the Lorax said:
As written, the Charm ability is cumbersome. Also you left out Cleric/Druid/Assassin (not to mention other non-core spell casters. It is nice to basically give the Worlock an extra invocation, but it meshes poorly with other classes.

The way I see Grazzt, he likes the Arcane spellcasters. Not so much the Divine ones. For Warlocks, it's right on-schedule -- they get their first Lesser Invocation at 6th level. For everyone else, it's a smaller bonus. Perhaps just "Charm Person" at will as a spell-like ability... hmm.



the Lorax said:
I'm going to assume that the original's summon demon ability is too much, so here goes...

Actually, I think it's too little -- the ability should scale. Who cares about some silly 10-hd demon when you're 20th level?

Dark Bargin (Sp): At 8th level the Thrall may cast Commune 1/day with a caster level equal to the Thrall's class level, paying no XP cost.

This I like. Back to the roots of "Grazzt Knows Secrets", which is a good thing... for evil!

I'll put in a few minor Divination-ish powers, that should wrap the whole thing up.

Thanks, Lorax! -- N
 

the Lorax

First Post
Nifft said:
Any Human arcane spellcaster could qualify by the end of 5th level -- the "cross class" social skill pre-reqs are low rank. :)

True as far as the skill points goes, but we are still talking 32 skill points for a wiz, I'd drop the Sense motive myself. My real concern was the 3 Feats, (which I suppose, a wizard of any race would have the possibility of getting too...) in combination with signifigant skill requirements.

Nifft said:
Perhaps just "Charm Person" at will as a spell-like ability... hmm.
Yeah, one thing I try to do is keep things as non-convoluted as possible.

Nifft said:
Actually, I think it's too little -- the ability should scale. Who cares about some silly 10-hd demon when you're 20th level?

Ah, ok, then perhaps something like Planar Ally would be better? Making fiendish bargins is fun! You wont get something much more powerful, but at least is would stick around longer. and its fiendish.

Nifft said:
Thanks, Lorax! -- N

NP, happy to help. :)
 

Nifft

Penguin Herder
the Lorax said:
Ah, ok, then perhaps something like Planar Ally would be better? Making fiendish bargins is fun! You wont get something much more powerful, but at least is would stick around longer. and its fiendish.

My "Summoner of the Skin" has that... I think it's a powerful ability, and a cool one, but I'd want it to cost more than two levels of spellcasting, and I don't think it's quite appropriate for Succubi etc.

IMHO, more "darkness" and "divination" themed abilities are appropriate.

More work on this when I'm done with work, or more likely tomorrow. :)

-- N
 


the Lorax

First Post
Thrall to Baphomet

Cultist of Baphomet

Role: Corrupted Hunter


Requirements:
Race: Must not be a minotaur
BAB: +3
Language: Abyssal
Feats: Demonic Thrall, Track
Skills: Survival 6+, Intimidate 3+
Alignment:any Evil
Special: Must worship the Demon-Prince Baphomet and survive the Dread Labyrinth

Cultist of Baphomet PrC
HD: d8
BAB: Full (as Fighter)
Good Save: Reflex, Fort / Bad Saves: Will
Skill Points: 2 + Int bonus
Class Skills: Craft (Int), Intimidate (Cha), Jump (Str), Listen (Wis), Search (Int), Spot (Wis), and Survival (Wis)

Code:
[u][SIZE=2]Level   BAB   Fort	Ref	Will	Special Abilities[/u]
1	+1	+2	+2	+0	Natural Armor +1, Beast Within, Darkvision 60 ft.
2	+2	+3	+3	+0	Powerful Charge, Gore 1d4, Keen Senses +1
3	+3	+3	+3	+1	Natural Armor +2, Natural Cunning, Smite Good 1/day
4	+4	+4	+4	+1	Str +2, Con +2, Keen Senses +2
5	+5	+4	+4	+1	+3 Natural Armor, Gore, Rage 1/day
6	+6	+5	+5	+2	Str +2, Scent, Natural Cunning, Keen Senses +3
7	+7	+5	+5	+2	Natural Armor +4, Con +2
8	+8	+6	+6	+2	Str +2, Int -2, Size Large, Keen Senses +4, Gore
9	+9	+6	+6	+3	Natural Armor +5, Natural Cunning, Beastial Change
10	+10	+7	+7     +3      Fiendish  Apotheosis, Rage 2/day
[/SIZE]

Special Abilities:
  • Beast Within: Upon completion of the initiation rituals, the celebrant begins his transformation. To perform the ritual, under fiendish guidance, the celebrant must partake of a human (or demi-human) sacrifice, hunting down the victim through a maze, and eating the victim's living flesh. The ritual costs the celebrant 2 points of Intelligence and 2 points of Charisma, grants the initiate +2 strength, its visage becomes visibly beastial, sprouting small horns from his head and can no longer be recognized as its original race.
  • Ability Modification: These are treated as though gained through level advancement.
  • Natural Armor (Ex): The character gains the indicated bonus in addition to whatever racial Natural Armor it had before entering the Thrall of Baphomet class.
  • Gore (Ex): The at 2nd level the Thrall's horns have grown enough for him to gain a gore attack which deals 1d4 + (Str x .5) damage. His horns continue to grow as he gains levels, increasing his base gore damage to 1d6 at 5th and 1d8 at 8th. This attack is treated as a secondary natural weapon.
  • Smite Good (Su): At 3rd level the Thrall's connection with his abyssal master has allowed him to land telling blows upon his enemies. Once per day the Thrall can make a normal melee attack to deal extr damage equal to its class level against a good foe.
  • Natural Cunning (Ex): At 3rd level the Trall begins to become instinctively aware of his surroundings, and can never become lost, and is always able to find a way out of mundane mazes. At 5th level this awarenes becomes even greater, and the Thrall can never be caught flat-footed. Finally at 9th level, the Thrall is no longer affected by the Maze spell.
  • Darkvision (Ex): As the Darkvision ability.
  • Bestial Change: At 9th level, the Thrall has become a minotaur, becoming a monsterous humaniod and losing its former type.
  • Fiendish Apotheosis: The Thrall has completed his transformation, takes on the Outsider [native] type, gains resistance against Fire 5 and Electricity 5, and gains DR 5 good.
  • Rage (Ex): As the Barbarian Rage ability.
  • Powerful Charge (Ex): At 2nd level, the Thrall may charge into combat by lowering his head and bringing his horns to bear, this attack deals 2d6 + (Str x 1.5) damage. The base damage increases to 2d8 at 5th level, and 4d6 at 8th.

*****

Notes: A fiendish minotaur with ECL bonus is effectively an 9th level character, With full BAB gain, and the Rage ability it Should be fairly balanced...

Edit: modified the Saves and requirements - I think it may be a bit to easy to enter now
 
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