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10ECL character for hack'n'slash module
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szilard
First Post
Other fun options:
Druid, shifting into either the Nature's Warrior or Warshaper prestige class. Take a level or two of Monk and add your maxed Wisdom to AC. You'll be at the point where you can Wild Shape into Large creatures and will be a grappling machine. Take a look at the Spontaneous Recuperation class feature option in PHBII.
Scout (Dungeon Specialist, from PHBII), multiclassing into either Ranger or Fighter and then Dervish. This would be kind of fun as a small character.
-Stuart
Druid, shifting into either the Nature's Warrior or Warshaper prestige class. Take a level or two of Monk and add your maxed Wisdom to AC. You'll be at the point where you can Wild Shape into Large creatures and will be a grappling machine. Take a look at the Spontaneous Recuperation class feature option in PHBII.
Scout (Dungeon Specialist, from PHBII), multiclassing into either Ranger or Fighter and then Dervish. This would be kind of fun as a small character.
-Stuart
Animal
First Post
sorry guys, but we must have different monster manuals. in my book it says that minotaurs have +2 level adjustment. am i missing something?
DM's greedy.
he says if we don't rely on high-powered items it'll help us make really diehard hardcore builds.thanks you all for interesting suggestions. i liked pixie rogue at first, but i must agree that he is just too frail. he'd be very hard to hit, but if hit he'd die instantly. on the other hand he is very versatile and if played carefully can outlive any encounter. i'm still considering it, sneak attacker, heavy poison user, maybe with some levels of sorc and arcane trickster?
speaking about minotaurs and half-ogres barbarians, those are very single-purposed builds. they have a lot of HP and deal a lot of physical punishment but they are pwned by any caster of comparable level. they're good at killing, but not very good at surviving. spellcasters are much better, having not only damaging and field-control spells, but also capable of retreating instantly if odds of battle do not favour them.
Iku Rex, of course i'm interested. i like the idea of shapechanging. i'd be grateful if you posted some of your builds. i'd go with sorc+draconic poly.
szilard, no PHBII please. we consider it to be totally broken. and until errata is published we agreed not to touch this herecy.
frankthedm
First Post
6 hit dice of monstrous humaniod. EACH counts as a "level" then add 2 ECLs and you have 8 levels spoken for. Add 2 more combatant levels and bing! 10th level PC.Animal said:
Monstrous humaniods have reflex and will as good saves along with Full BAB. Few other monster types have HD this good and none other than dragon compare to class levels. Outsider is close, but very risky due to a lot of send you home effects out there.
There are some folk who let monster HD be dropped. Not many. There is no offical word if ECL "accounts" for those HD being there. I suspect it does.
Sorcerer it is. A wizard based build will be more powerful (more spells, more feats, can cram in a level of monk and still get Draconic Polymorph), but the sorcerer gives you more staying power. (I dropped the sacred exorcist/divine might trick, as the char was short on feats, spells and skills.)
Dragonborn (RoD) dream dwarf (RoS) or dragonborn shield dwarf (FRCS) Sorcerer 10.
(For Con bonuses.)
If the DM lets you use Skip Williams' hit point ruling from http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20040525a you don't need that high a Con - the new form's Con will boost your hit points more than enough. (Just make sure you're sufficiently healed before you change back.)
Rat Familiar for the +2 Fort
Racial substitution levels: I haven't included any, but the character qualifies for both "dwarven sorcerer" (RoS) and "dragonblood sorcerer". Worth considering.
Skills:
Max spellcraft. (You want to know what to shut down with Wings of Cover) One rank of tumble is always nice.
Feats:
Power Attack, Improved Toughness (CW), Force of Personality (CAdv), Spell Versatility (RoD)
Power Attack low AC opponents - with your typical Str you'll still hit. Improved Toughness (more HPs) and Force of Personality (better Will saves against mind-affecting) helps with your defenses. Spell Versatility lets you use a few extra Draconic Polymorphs or Wraithstrikes in a pinch.
Equipment:
4000 Cloak of Charisma +2
4000 vest of Resistance +2 (CArc)
4100 Armbands of Might (CAdv)
6000 Amulet of Mighty Fists +1
1750 7 diamond dust stoneskin components
150 gp left
There's a lot of stuff you'll want in the future - Str, Dex, Con and better Cha. A Ring of Counterspells could take care of a targeted dispel. Better resistance bonus to saves is also a priority. Get Dusty Rose Ioun Stone and Ring of Protection for more AC.
Dedicated melee spell list:
(Magic missile wouldn't hurt, but I'm going for a theme - draconic badass. )
5th (1 known, 4/day): Draconic Polymorph (D)
4th (2 known, 5/day): Stoneskin, Flight of the Dragon (SC)
3rd (3 known, 7/day): Girallon's Blessing (SC), Blink, Dragonskin (SC)
2nd (4 known, 7/day): Wraithstrike (SC), Wings of Cover (RoD), Alter Self, Heroics (SC)
1st (5 known, 8/day): Mage Armor, Shield, Protection from Evil, Fist of Stone (SC), Weapon Shift (SC)
Spell tactics:
Stoneskin, Flight of the Dragon, Girallon's Blessing, Dragonskin, Alter Self, Heroics and Mage Armor last 100 minutes or more. That should be enough to go through most "dungeons". Make sure you cast them in advance. Alter Self to a tren from Serpent Kingdoms. Online: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20040613a&page=4. There was only gold for three stoneskin components, so buy more ASAP. (Edit: Added four more.)
Draconic Polymorph, Shield and Protection from Evil can also be precast in many situations. Just don't waste too many lower level slots - they can be used for Wraithstrike or Wings of Cover.
Blink is the main short term in-combat buff. (Fist of Stone is another, but it's not so great with natural weapons.) It gives you both offense, defense and a way out of a bad situation. You can even go through closed doors.
Heroics gives you versatility. (List of fighter feats: http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=162698 ) Use it to get exotic weapon proficiency and Weapon Shift can provide the weapon. (If the DM allows it the Savage Species rules for multi-handed weapons lets you combine it with Girallon's Blessing for 2.5 Str bonus to damage.)
Wraithstrike is your power word: DIE. Use it on the BBEG with a cave troll pounce.
Wings of Cover is a sick spell. It can block almost any attack as an immediate action. Always save a couple of slots to block dispels.
Some game stats buffed in cave troll form, blinking, not Shield or Protection from Evil:
HPs: 4+4d9 + 10*6 (20 Con +2 from Draconic Polymorph) + 10 (Improved Toughness) = 96 (avg.)
AC: 10 base - 1 Large + 1 Dex + 11 natural armor (Cave Troll) + 4 armor (Mage Armor) + 5 natural armor enhancement (Dragonskin) = 30 (34 with Shield, 36 with Protection from Evil), opponent has 50% miss chance.
To hit: 5 BAB + -1 Large + 13 Str (cave troll with +8 Str) + 1 enhancement + 2 blinking -2 Power Attack (to activate armbands) = +18/+18/+18/+18/+13, 20% miss chance, no Dex against your attacks
Damage: 1d6 (Large) +13 (Str) + 2 (PA) + 2 (Armbands) +1 enhancement = 1d6+18 per claw, 1d6 + 11 bite. If two claws, 2d6+19 rend and DC 23 Fort save or dazed.
For real damage, crank up the PA and charge (pounce and rake) with Wraithstrike. I don't care if they have DR - that's probably gonna hurt...
Dragonborn (RoD) dream dwarf (RoS) or dragonborn shield dwarf (FRCS) Sorcerer 10.
(For Con bonuses.)
Code:
32 point buy
Item Levels
Str 14
Dex 10 -4
Con 16 +4
Int 12
Wis 8
Cha 16 +2 +2If the DM lets you use Skip Williams' hit point ruling from http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/rg/20040525a you don't need that high a Con - the new form's Con will boost your hit points more than enough. (Just make sure you're sufficiently healed before you change back.)
Rat Familiar for the +2 Fort
Racial substitution levels: I haven't included any, but the character qualifies for both "dwarven sorcerer" (RoS) and "dragonblood sorcerer". Worth considering.
Skills:
Max spellcraft. (You want to know what to shut down with Wings of Cover) One rank of tumble is always nice.
Feats:
Power Attack, Improved Toughness (CW), Force of Personality (CAdv), Spell Versatility (RoD)
Power Attack low AC opponents - with your typical Str you'll still hit. Improved Toughness (more HPs) and Force of Personality (better Will saves against mind-affecting) helps with your defenses. Spell Versatility lets you use a few extra Draconic Polymorphs or Wraithstrikes in a pinch.
Equipment:
4000 Cloak of Charisma +2
4000 vest of Resistance +2 (CArc)
4100 Armbands of Might (CAdv)
6000 Amulet of Mighty Fists +1
1750 7 diamond dust stoneskin components
150 gp left
There's a lot of stuff you'll want in the future - Str, Dex, Con and better Cha. A Ring of Counterspells could take care of a targeted dispel. Better resistance bonus to saves is also a priority. Get Dusty Rose Ioun Stone and Ring of Protection for more AC.
Dedicated melee spell list:
(Magic missile wouldn't hurt, but I'm going for a theme - draconic badass.
)5th (1 known, 4/day): Draconic Polymorph (D)
4th (2 known, 5/day): Stoneskin, Flight of the Dragon (SC)
3rd (3 known, 7/day): Girallon's Blessing (SC), Blink, Dragonskin (SC)
2nd (4 known, 7/day): Wraithstrike (SC), Wings of Cover (RoD), Alter Self, Heroics (SC)
1st (5 known, 8/day): Mage Armor, Shield, Protection from Evil, Fist of Stone (SC), Weapon Shift (SC)
Spell tactics:
Stoneskin, Flight of the Dragon, Girallon's Blessing, Dragonskin, Alter Self, Heroics and Mage Armor last 100 minutes or more. That should be enough to go through most "dungeons". Make sure you cast them in advance. Alter Self to a tren from Serpent Kingdoms. Online: http://www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/iw/20040613a&page=4. There was only gold for three stoneskin components, so buy more ASAP. (Edit: Added four more.)
Draconic Polymorph, Shield and Protection from Evil can also be precast in many situations. Just don't waste too many lower level slots - they can be used for Wraithstrike or Wings of Cover.
Blink is the main short term in-combat buff. (Fist of Stone is another, but it's not so great with natural weapons.) It gives you both offense, defense and a way out of a bad situation. You can even go through closed doors.
Heroics gives you versatility. (List of fighter feats: http://www.enworld.org/showthread.php?t=162698 ) Use it to get exotic weapon proficiency and Weapon Shift can provide the weapon. (If the DM allows it the Savage Species rules for multi-handed weapons lets you combine it with Girallon's Blessing for 2.5 Str bonus to damage.)
Wraithstrike is your power word: DIE. Use it on the BBEG with a cave troll pounce.
Wings of Cover is a sick spell. It can block almost any attack as an immediate action. Always save a couple of slots to block dispels.
Some game stats buffed in cave troll form, blinking, not Shield or Protection from Evil:
HPs: 4+4d9 + 10*6 (20 Con +2 from Draconic Polymorph) + 10 (Improved Toughness) = 96 (avg.)
AC: 10 base - 1 Large + 1 Dex + 11 natural armor (Cave Troll) + 4 armor (Mage Armor) + 5 natural armor enhancement (Dragonskin) = 30 (34 with Shield, 36 with Protection from Evil), opponent has 50% miss chance.
To hit: 5 BAB + -1 Large + 13 Str (cave troll with +8 Str) + 1 enhancement + 2 blinking -2 Power Attack (to activate armbands) = +18/+18/+18/+18/+13, 20% miss chance, no Dex against your attacks
Damage: 1d6 (Large) +13 (Str) + 2 (PA) + 2 (Armbands) +1 enhancement = 1d6+18 per claw, 1d6 + 11 bite. If two claws, 2d6+19 rend and DC 23 Fort save or dazed.
For real damage, crank up the PA and charge (pounce and rake) with Wraithstrike. I don't care if they have DR - that's probably gonna hurt...
Last edited:
frankthedm
First Post
Half dragons get racial HD bumped, not class.Nightfall said:
Hit Dice
Increase base creature’s racial HD by one die size, to a maximum of d12. Do not increase class HD.
Animal
First Post
fankthedm, nightfall, in this case say goliaph or half-orc barbarian would be twice as good as minotaur.. imho gore attack, strength boost and large size can't be worth 8 character levels.
Iku Rex, this is some great build. unfortunately i don't have Races of Dragon yet, so i don't know what's dragonborn, spell versatility feat and wings of cover. but all in all it looks very powerful. i failed to find any of those spells you mentioned in my SC though. maybe they were published in some later supplements? flight of dragon is a 5th level spell from D. and draconic polymorph must be draconic might? and why is it better to alter self to tren? what's BBEG?
Iku Rex, this is some great build. unfortunately i don't have Races of Dragon yet, so i don't know what's dragonborn, spell versatility feat and wings of cover. but all in all it looks very powerful. i failed to find any of those spells you mentioned in my SC though. maybe they were published in some later supplements? flight of dragon is a 5th level spell from D. and draconic polymorph must be draconic might? and why is it better to alter self to tren? what's BBEG?
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