20th level before his 20th birthday
wingsandsword
Legend
Real-life medieval example of a "20th level before 20th birthday" person, Joan of Arc. Leading armies at 17, by her 20th birthday she had been a major military leader and was awaiting execution by her enemies (which happened when she was 19).
Just to show that a high-level female fighter with Leadership is possible even in a "realistic", low-magic, "gritty" setting
Just to show that a high-level female fighter with Leadership is possible even in a "realistic", low-magic, "gritty" setting
I'm A Banana
Potassium-Rich
Down time? Pheh!
"Live Fast, Die Young": The Adventurer's Code.
"Live Fast, Die Young": The Adventurer's Code.
painandgreed
First Post
I like to draw out my campaigns in time. Here are some of the methods I use:
The big time waster is training at low levels. To improve BAB, HP or other pre-existing abilities doesn't take any time as neither does actually gaining the level, but to learn anything new like a new skill or feat requires being taught in most cases. This can take days to months depending on what it is. After they get some money, they start wanting specially made items and those take time to make. Spell casters take the most time as it can take a long time to learn any new spells. Once they get higher level then making their own spells can take years which they might be willing to allow if its a really useful spell. For those people who don't have anyhting to do or wait for, I allow them to train with others for a cost (or favor) which gives a few XP per day doing so. Enough to keep them from complaining but not enough to unbalance things with the other players.
Typically, all of that gets longer than the mere sum. The party may be ready but one person will be doing stuff that they're willing to wait for. The rest go off and start their own projects and studying. The one person is finished but now everybody else is working on stuff so he begins a new project, etc. etc. I had one campaign (an elvish one) where the players were given a task by the queen and told to begin within the next two years. A suitably elvish thing which they would have no trouble with I figured. Two years later, they had not even left the city and the Queen's guards had to come and escort them outside the city gates because they were still busy learning spells and crafting items they thought they'd want on the adventure.
Another big one is simple travel time. It takes time to get form here to there which can take much longer very quickly. Rain can cut movement down to nothing or even make it impossible, thus prevent characters from leaving their camp or inn for days or weeks. Natural obstructions such as flooded rivers or snowed in mountain passes can do the same. Without snowplows, snow will make travel impossible in all but the shortest distances. Between snow in the winter and floods and mud caused by spring rains, travel (and therefore adventuring) might not even be possible for up to half the year in some regions.
The big time waster is training at low levels. To improve BAB, HP or other pre-existing abilities doesn't take any time as neither does actually gaining the level, but to learn anything new like a new skill or feat requires being taught in most cases. This can take days to months depending on what it is. After they get some money, they start wanting specially made items and those take time to make. Spell casters take the most time as it can take a long time to learn any new spells. Once they get higher level then making their own spells can take years which they might be willing to allow if its a really useful spell. For those people who don't have anyhting to do or wait for, I allow them to train with others for a cost (or favor) which gives a few XP per day doing so. Enough to keep them from complaining but not enough to unbalance things with the other players.
Typically, all of that gets longer than the mere sum. The party may be ready but one person will be doing stuff that they're willing to wait for. The rest go off and start their own projects and studying. The one person is finished but now everybody else is working on stuff so he begins a new project, etc. etc. I had one campaign (an elvish one) where the players were given a task by the queen and told to begin within the next two years. A suitably elvish thing which they would have no trouble with I figured. Two years later, they had not even left the city and the Queen's guards had to come and escort them outside the city gates because they were still busy learning spells and crafting items they thought they'd want on the adventure.
Another big one is simple travel time. It takes time to get form here to there which can take much longer very quickly. Rain can cut movement down to nothing or even make it impossible, thus prevent characters from leaving their camp or inn for days or weeks. Natural obstructions such as flooded rivers or snowed in mountain passes can do the same. Without snowplows, snow will make travel impossible in all but the shortest distances. Between snow in the winter and floods and mud caused by spring rains, travel (and therefore adventuring) might not even be possible for up to half the year in some regions.
Incenjucar
Legend
Well, considering some anime`...
Part of the problem is that D&D characters get more powerful compared to each other than anything in the real world. You also have the issue of 'in their prime'. You also have that age matters more to some classes than others, which creates a balance issue. An old wizard is happy as a clam and hurling fireballs like a pro. And old rogue is a little stiff, but their skill beats out any youngin'. An old warrior is complaining about his aching joints and is starting to hit softer.
Part of the problem is that D&D characters get more powerful compared to each other than anything in the real world. You also have the issue of 'in their prime'. You also have that age matters more to some classes than others, which creates a balance issue. An old wizard is happy as a clam and hurling fireballs like a pro. And old rogue is a little stiff, but their skill beats out any youngin'. An old warrior is complaining about his aching joints and is starting to hit softer.
Sebastian Francis
First Post
Incenjucar said:
Not to mention soaking in a hot bath after every battle and complaining about how stiff his muscles are.
But then in comes a saucy wench to loosen him up . . .
![:]](http://www.enworld.org/forum/images/smilies/devious.png "Devious :]")
Sebastian Francis
First Post
I'm surprised that no one's mentioned the problem of different races and their respective differences in longevity.
Consider this:
A human reaches adulthood at age 15; an elf at age 110. Until that time, both are more or less children.
For the next 50 years they both train and adventure, until, at age 65/160, respectively, they reach 20th level.
The human is now "Old" and 5 years shy of "Venerable". As an "Old" character he gains the following penalties: -2 to STR, CON, DEX (if he's a fighter or barbarian, it stings). He also gains the following bonuses: +1 to INT, WIS, and CHA.
The elf, by contrast, is *not even middle age*. He won't reach "Middle Age" for 10 more years!
Let's go back to the human. His maximum possible age (barring magical effects) is 70 + 2d20 years, which would, at the highest possible roll, make him 110 years old when he dies.
The elf, standing at the bedside of his dying 110-year-old human buddy, is quietly weeping. After all, he and this human have been adventuring for 95 years--since they were both young adults (15/110 respectively). The elf, however, is still only 205 years old--"Middle Age". He has a mere -1 penalty to STR, DEX, and CON, and gains +1 to INT, WIS, and CHA. Even worse, he's still *** 58 *** years away from being "Old"!
Now, who exactly is this elf's competition? Young, strapping, 1st level humans? You can start to understand why in AD&D 1e and 2e they had level limits for demihuman races. Realistically, dwarves and elves (and perhaps gnomes) should be the demigod, 60th level rulers of the world. ANY world, BTW. Pick yer setting.
Consider this:
A human reaches adulthood at age 15; an elf at age 110. Until that time, both are more or less children.
For the next 50 years they both train and adventure, until, at age 65/160, respectively, they reach 20th level.
The human is now "Old" and 5 years shy of "Venerable". As an "Old" character he gains the following penalties: -2 to STR, CON, DEX (if he's a fighter or barbarian, it stings). He also gains the following bonuses: +1 to INT, WIS, and CHA.
The elf, by contrast, is *not even middle age*. He won't reach "Middle Age" for 10 more years!
Let's go back to the human. His maximum possible age (barring magical effects) is 70 + 2d20 years, which would, at the highest possible roll, make him 110 years old when he dies.
The elf, standing at the bedside of his dying 110-year-old human buddy, is quietly weeping. After all, he and this human have been adventuring for 95 years--since they were both young adults (15/110 respectively). The elf, however, is still only 205 years old--"Middle Age". He has a mere -1 penalty to STR, DEX, and CON, and gains +1 to INT, WIS, and CHA. Even worse, he's still *** 58 *** years away from being "Old"!
Now, who exactly is this elf's competition? Young, strapping, 1st level humans? You can start to understand why in AD&D 1e and 2e they had level limits for demihuman races. Realistically, dwarves and elves (and perhaps gnomes) should be the demigod, 60th level rulers of the world. ANY world, BTW. Pick yer setting.
PeterDonis
First Post
Sebastian Francis said:
This logic assumes that, unless you die (either from old age or while adventuring), your rate of gaining levels remains constant no matter how high in level you get. But realistically, as you get higher in level, it should get harder and harder for you to find challenges equal to your level. CR 1 orcs are a lot more common than CR 20 dragons. So as you go up in level, your rate of gaining levels should decrease, simply because the average CR of the challenges you meet doesn't keep up with your level. So the elf whose lifetime is 10 times that of a human might not really get many extra levels out of it, because it's so rare for him to find challenges that gain him significant XP.
Kamikaze Midget said:
I'm also for rapid advancement to keep the game interesting, full of action, and the characters lively.....but hé 1 lvl a game or every other game is waaaaay to fast for me. We play short lived campaigns/adventures and play about once a week and every month or so we go up a level, that's a nice pace for me......
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