D&D 3E/3.5 [3.5] scorching ray?

[Mike Sullivan]

I still feel that having to make multiple attack rolls, and the magic missile/fireball comparison places it as a good, but balanced, 2nd level spell.

The multiple attack rolls thing basically makes it more likely to be the average. A Polar Ray is an all-or-nothing affair -- you either hit with it or miss. You can compute the average damage, but it's something of a fiction, like saying that the "average" of flipping a coin is 50% heads, 50% tails -- obviously, you never actually get that*.

The three attack rolls on a Scorching Ray means that you have four possible outcomes: none hit, one hits, two hit, or three hit. Thus, your damage is more likely to be closer to the average, rather than either being much lower than the average or significantly higher.








* I actually did once flip a coin and have it come down on the edge and stay there, much to my amazement. But that's kind of tangential to the point.

 

[MadScientist]

I think the spell is fine at 4d6 damage. If it was 3d6 magic missile would compare too favorably to it. It's higher level AND requires a touch attack roll, it needs to have more damage potential than MM.

 

[LokiDR]

The damage seems right for 2nd level. A direct damage spell in 2nd level that doesn't suck is the strange part.

 

[Gwarthkam]

The multiple attack rolls thing basically makes it more likely to be the average. A Polar Ray is an all-or-nothing affair -- you either hit with it or miss. You can compute the average damage, but it's something of a fiction, like saying that the "average" of flipping a coin is 50% heads, 50% tails -- obviously, you never actually get that*.

The three attack rolls on a Scorching Ray means that you have four possible outcomes: none hit, one hits, two hit, or three hit. Thus, your damage is more likely to be closer to the average, rather than either being much lower than the average or significantly higher.

Yes, a Polar Ray has higher volatility, but the distribution of the damage rolls shouldn't matter in this context as increased or decreased volatility can be an advantage or disadvantage, all depending on the situation.

 

[Mike Sullivan]

Yes, a Polar Ray has higher volatility, but the distribution of the damage rolls shouldn't matter in this context as increased or decreased volatility can be an advantage or disadvantage, all depending on the situation.

Right, I agree. I'm noting that the difference between three attack rolls or one is just a difference of standard deviation, not of total efficacy.

 

[Croaker]

In all the calculations for comparing Scorching Ray vs. Magic Missile vs. Melf's, were the possibilities of critical hits factored in? A 1/20 chance of 8d6 (compared to no chance for MM, or 4d4 for Melf's) has got to skew things in favor of SR, especially since at higher levels the caster gets multiple attempts to get a crit with each casting. Also, I imagine that wands of SR are going to look very attractive for mid- to high-level rogues for making ranged sneak attacks via Use Magice Device, since a base 4d6 damage and a touch attack is far superior to any kind of magic bow and arrows they could acquire. Finally, since SR allows no save, it is even more deadly than Fireball under the new Cold and Fire subtype rules (-10 to save against opposing energy type, or double damage if no save is allowed). Toss in Energy Substitution (assuming it is still legal under 3.5), maybe Improved Crit: Ray, and it is a spell that remains a killer into the high levels.

 

[Number47]

It is not nearly as good at getting around fire resistance, as each shot has resistance applied to it. That is one thing that polar ray does have going for it, the damage is less affected by cold resistance than scorching ray is by fire resistance. I think it also fair to point out that fire resistance or immunity is by far the most common. That give a slight boost for Melfs. This is a great troll-killer spell, though.

 

[DonAdam]

My problem isn't so much with scorching ray as it is with Polar Ray. I feel like it should be d8 or d10 or have some kind of freezing effect (a la Diablo) like Slowing the target

 

[isoChron]

Never underestimate force damage vs. fire damage.
Every guy chooses fire as first protection/immunity because so many spells do fire damage. Force damage is a little more nasty since it works on the ethereal plane also. See incorporal undead...
And you can empower and maximize your MM, too.
BYE

 

[Tellerve]

remember that melf's acid arrow now has no saving throw along with no spell resistance check by the critter you hit.

Tellerve