D&D 3E/3.5 3e Made Me Into a Gronard

[Toben the Many]

I was doing some design work for a game company that I work for and coming up with new abilities for characters for an expansion book.

I sent my material over to our playtesting group and they ripped my stuff apart as usual. No surprise there. But I got the most interesting comment from them.

One of their complaints was that many of the abilities I was coming up with were very much like Feats and other abilities they had seen in 3rd Edition. Keep in mind that we're using an independent game system with nary a d20 in the game.

This trend was not limited to me. We saw the same thing in our pile of suggestions we got from fans and other players for our expansion book. Everywhere we turned people were suggesting Feats and abilities that resembled stuff right out of the 3e books.

Yet, our game doesn't play like 3e at all. It's not meant to. The 3e mentality doesn't work in our game system. It's right then and there that I realized where a lot of my gronardism has been tied up into the fact the 3rd Edition has infected my brain. I tend to think of things in a 3rd Edition fashion. Abilities that compliment each other, each separate ability giving small increments of things. Etc.

In any case, I think that much of my gronardism against 4e has been because 3rd Edition has really infected my brain. If something's not done in a 3e kind of way, I tend to get grumpy about it. Defenses instead of saving throws? Bah. Proficiencies instead of skills? Grr. No sorcerer? Grah!

Thoughts?

 

[Khairn]

You found a system that you appear to enjoy and makes "sense" to you. Its provided you with an internal framework for some of your creative endeavors. Is this a problem?

 

[Rechan]

Is this a problem?

When you're trying to do something separate from 3e D&D, I imagine it does. The OP is a game designer doing things apart from 3e. So... it sounds problematic to me.

It reminds me of "The Brady Bunch" movie where the father, an architect, keeps getting hired to do jobs and all he can design is a house that looks exactly like his house. Except that the jobs are for "Office Building" and such - thus his designs get rejected.

 

[MaelStorm]

It is perfectly normal to have preference. You see the world in a 3E fashion, why not?

You are free to choose what you want in your life. What is wrong about this?

 

[mattcolville]

It's, ah, "grognard" actually.

 

[Voss]

It doesn't sound like a grognard, anyway. You just have a strong preference. Which is to say, you're confusing a greenhouse for a rainforest.

 

[Zaruthustran]

If the OP's conclusion re: the origin of his grognardism is true, then it seems highly likely he'll become a 4E grognard after he plays 4E for a while.

 

[Toben the Many]

There's more to it than that.

What I'm talking about is that many of our player and fans tend to think about things in a 3e sort of way. What I'm saying is that d20 has really infected everyone and their gaming style. Heck, even the new World of Darkness system has much of the same feel that 3e has/had.

And I think that may be the source of much my "grognardism". I'm wondering if it's not the source of many other peoples' grognardism.

Basically, what I'm saying is that I suspect many people who have been decrying 4e are fearing change. Quite natural, really. I have some of that myself. But what I'm also saying is that 3e might have made us really afraid of change because of the mentality that it fostered.

 

[Gargauth]

Colonial horror?

 

[Fallen Seraph]

I can't say I get a 3e vibe off nWoD, but that may just be me. All I know one system (3e) frustrates me to no-end and one system (nWoD) I adore to no-end.