D&D 5E 5th Edition has broken Bounded Accuracy

[Giltonio_Santos]

Needing basically the same numbers to hit from 1 to 20 is what I'd call "4E bounded accuracy". In 5E, having a very high ability score or a very powerful magic weapon are actually expected to change the balance of the game in your favor. If you don't like that, you should try point-buy and weapons without a bonus to hit, as someone suggested earlier.

 

[mlund]

Well, Monster HP scales faster than PC damage so hitting more often is a nice way of helping keep the game pacing, IMO.

 

[EzekielRaiden]

Needing basically the same numbers to hit from 1 to 20 is what I'd call "4E bounded accuracy". In 5E, having a very high ability score or a very powerful magic weapon are actually expected to change the balance of the game in your favor. If you don't like that, you should try point-buy and weapons without a bonus to hit, as someone suggested earlier.

Not specifically singling you out here, just picking this as the most recent statement of the opinion...

I have to laugh at everyone being so...blasé about stating that "Bounded Accuracy" isn't really about being bounded (since the numbers still go up quite quickly, to the tune of +5 or +6 over 9 levels, and another +4 or 5 over the next 9 as well), and isn't really about accuracy (since the thing that really scales fast is HP).

Gotta love 5e and its "natural language"!

 

[AverageCitizen]

Keep in mind not everything in the game is "bounded" evenly. Accuracy and skills are bound to the same rate of increase (proficiency + modifier), but AC is bound to a much more restrictive rate (flat armor + modifier/portion of modifier/nothing). So just like high level characters are more likely to succeed on skills, they are more likely to hit. So I'd anticipate that the HP scale rate would account for that, but I am not sure since I haven't looked at it. However, others in the thread have made statements to that effect.

PS: Flat armor bonus scales a bit as PCs buy better armor, but there is one upgrade, maybe two, in that process. It still doesn't keep up with proficiency.

 

[Lord Vangarel]

Hit points not AC is the scaling challenge mechanism. They are supposed to hit frequently.

Frequently yes, all the time, not so sure.

 

[Parmandur]

Not specifically singling you out here, just picking this as the most recent statement of the opinion...

I have to laugh at everyone being so...blasé about stating that "Bounded Accuracy" isn't really about being bounded (since the numbers still go up quite quickly, to the tune of +5 or +6 over 9 levels, and another +4 or 5 over the next 9 as well), and isn't really about accuracy (since the thing that really scales fast is HP).

Gotta love 5e and its "natural language"!

Things level up, of course; this is D&D. But it is bounded in that you could inverse the numbers, full on THAC0, and they still work. Unlike the infinite curve of 3E and 4E that was...pretty meh.

 

[Sacrosanct]

Frequently yes, all the time, not so sure.

Again, judging by your other thread, get your players to stop cheating and most of you issues will be resolved.

 

[Lord Vangarel]

Again, judging by your other thread, get your players to stop cheating and most of you issues will be resolved.

Yes stopping suspected cheating is the primary aim however I was looking at the numbers when this occurred to me.

I don't want unlimited AC's I'm very happy with that aspect. My issue is that by mid levels hitting seems almost automatic. Roll in feats like GWM and Sharpshooter add in Lucky and Advantage and it's almost becomes who can do the most damage wins the fight as missing doesn't happen.

I was thinking magic items shouldn't give bonuses but other benefits. Also tempted to reduce bonuses from stats.

 

[ad_hoc]

I was thinking magic items shouldn't give bonuses but other benefits. Also tempted to reduce bonuses from stats.

Good thing both of these are already in the system.

Many magic weapons and armour already don't give plusses. It's not longer assumed that every one will be at least +1. They are very easy to remove as well.

The base game has stats maxing out at 20 and no feats to further boost things. So by level 8 you can have your 20 and then have nowhere else to go. There are a lot of things you can do with stats that don't require an overhaul of the system. You could lower the max starting stat 14 or lower. You could only allow a +1/+1 instead of +2 and disallow feats (or only the +1 feats).

Personally I think characters should be heroic at levels 8+. But then I consider 11+ to be high level. I don't have any interest in playing above 15.

 

[Prism]

Frequently yes, all the time, not so sure.

I'm playing a 20th level character with maxed stats and a +3 weapon. I can state that I do not hit all the time. Using great weapon master is risky unless I get advantage, as one miss usually means less damage and two misses certainly does. In play, at least for us, it doesn't seem a problem