D&D General A Class's Spell List Should be Listed With the Class Description.

[Vaalingrade]

Or give the Cleric a 3rd level spell instead of the wizard's leavings.

 

[Horwath]

Which only works until different classes get the same spell at different levels, at which point you're duplicating write-ups.

when does this happen in 5e?

 

[Lanefan]

when does this happen in 5e?

I'm not sure it does, but I maintain that in some cases it should; as doing so opens up a lot of design space to have some casters be better at certain spell types than others (e.g. Illusionists getting illusion spells at lower level than generalist Mages, even though they are the same spells).

 

[Horwath]

I'm not sure it does, but I maintain that in some cases it should; as doing so opens up a lot of design space to have some casters be better at certain spell types than others (e.g. Illusionists getting illusion spells at lower level than generalist Mages, even though they are the same spells).

that was one of the worst aspects of 3E.

1st level spells should be 1st level spells or 5th should be 5th.
no matter the class/subclass.
It just adds confusion and inconsistency.

if you want someone to be better at certain spells, it is already done with features that buff certain spells, I.E. healer cleric,

 

[jmartkdr2]

when does this happen in 5e?

It doesn't. There's a few cases where similar spells kinda do this (flame strike is a cleric's fireball but at fifth level) but it's always a discrete spell.

 

[Lanefan]

that was one of the worst aspects of 3E.

Disagree on that; it's something 3e (and 1e, and I think 2e) got right.

1st level spells should be 1st level spells or 5th should be 5th.
no matter the class/subclass.

One caster's 1st-level spell is another caster's 5th.

It just adds confusion and inconsistency.

it only adds confusion if you're looking at spell lists not your own.

The spell is the spell, and the write-up would say how (if at all) it varies when different classes cast it.

if you want someone to be better at certain spells, it is already done with features that buff certain spells, I.E. healer cleric,

No reason not to also do this.

 

[Horwath]

Disagree on that; it's something 3e (and 1e, and I think 2e) got right.

Guess we'll agree to disagree

One caster's 1st-level spell is another caster's 5th.

That is represented by getting spell slots of certain level at later class level.

But then again, I have a variant that half casters get spell slots at same levels as full casters, but less of them.
No reason that paladin cannot enjoy 5th level spells from 9th level, but paladin will have only a single 5th level spell slot until 19th level when as normal would get second 5th level spell slot.

 

[Hussar]

And note, classes that are getting spells from another class' list are doing so through subclass which defines when you get that spell.