A Good Fighter/Rogue/Wizard Build?

[RisingLegend]

Hi,
I am looking to make a Hybrid class that can sneak attack like a rogue, disguise themselves well (perhaps by being a Changeling race?) and hide in shadows, but instead of daggers uses heavy weapons, like a Fullblade or Sickle or something awesome like that and can also use basic/intermediate elemental spells like blasts of fire from my palm or ice bolts and stuff like that. Any ideas of what I could pursue prestige wise or what i should lvl up class wise, what skills and perks I should pick and when? I'm not experienced at all (only played one time with a build someone made for me) So detailed lvling examples from a hardened vet would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks!!

 

[Nemesis Destiny]

Welcome to ENWorld!

Well, for starters, Rogue's Sneak Attack will not work with anything bigger than a 1d8 Rapier or Shortbow. Dwarven Rogues can make it work with 1d10 Warhammers at the cost of one die of sneak attack damage (i.e. not worth it). Big weapons do work with some of the other striker damage mechanics, such as the Ranger's Hunter's Quarry, but Ranger does not hybrid well with anything that has decent at-will implement powers that do elemental damage, except maybe druid, but you'd have to choose powers carefully for both classes (going Dex + Wis, probably).

You might like the Hexblade class. It's a melee and close range Warlock that uses magically conjured melee weapons that are already big and ridiculous (that you can fluff more or less however you want) without having to spend feats, and they have an at-will force bolt attack. If you're human, you can get another warlock at-will power with your human bonus at-will. They don't have Sneak Attack, per se, but they do have a damage-boosting mechanic that just applies to all their attacks.

I don't believe they have released hybrid Hexblade support yet, but when they do this would work pretty well with the Sorcerer for more arcane elemental attacks. In the meantime, you can hybrid regualr Warlock with something like Sorcerer or Wizard, and buy the Hexblade's ability to use a big whacky weapon via the Pact Blade Manifestation feat (not in the builder yet). This gives you the Hexblade's weapon and the at-will attack associated with it, though with such a combination, unless you have really high Int or Dex, or you decide to buy armour proficiency, your defences will be pretty low for someone in melee. Warlock|Wizard is probably your best bet, using a race that gets a +2 to both Int and Cha, or Con + Int.

 

[Dr_Ruminahui]

Sounds like an original assassin (sneaky, has a backstab mechanic (shrouds rather than sneak attack), benefits from using a large weapon) multiclassed/hybridded with sorceror. The original assassin also has a lot of powers that let you jump between shadows. The OAssassin has a Dex/Cha build, and the sorceror a Cha/Dex one.

And yes, changeling if you want to be able to disguise yourself... imposters armour and dynamic weapon are also good from a disguise perspective. The Changeling also has the advantage of being a Cha/Dex race.

There is also a feat that lets you sneak attack with a heavy blade, but given how many rogue powers require a light blade, I don't know how viable that actually is.

 

[Klaus]

Let's see:

- Striker.
- Uses large weapons.
- Dabbles into area spells.

I'd say go Hexblade. For added coolness, you'll be creating your big weapon out of eldritch power, and that's just METAL!

 

[Nemesis Destiny]

Sounds like an original assassin (sneaky, has a backstab mechanic (shrouds rather than sneak attack), benefits from using a large weapon) multiclassed/hybridded with sorceror. And yes, changeling if you want to be able to disguise yourself... imposters armour is good for that too.

Yeah, this sounds viable as well. I have never had any interest in the assassin class, but there you go. I forgot about the shapechange that the OP wanted, but a Changeling works well for my Int + Cha Wizard|Warlock build idea.

There is also a feat that lets you sneak attack with a heavy blade, but given how many rogue powers require a light blade, I don't know how viable that actually is.

The feat in question, Versatile Duelist, lets you use any one-handed military heavy blade with a rogue power that requires a light blade, but does nothing to waive the requirement that Sneak Attack only be used with a light blade, sling, short bow or hand crossbow, so you are correct in that its use is dubious at best.

In my home game, I allow it to work with Sneak Attack as well, because at best the Rogue is trading a point of accuracy for a 1d10 damage die. Unless the Rogue uses a longsword, at +3/1d8, it's not exactly optimal when that feat could have been spent on Rapier proficiency, and still get to benefit from all the good light blade support feats.

 

[Pentius]

Hi,
I am looking to make a Hybrid class that can sneak attack like a rogue, disguise themselves well (perhaps by being a Changeling race?) and hide in shadows, but instead of daggers uses heavy weapons, like a Fullblade or Sickle or something awesome like that and can also use basic/intermediate elemental spells like blasts of fire from my palm or ice bolts and stuff like that. Any ideas of what I could pursue prestige wise or what i should lvl up class wise, what skills and perks I should pick and when? I'm not experienced at all (only played one time with a build someone made for me) So detailed lvling examples from a hardened vet would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks!!

I'm backing up the Hexblade recommendation. You won't have the actual mechanic called Sneak Attack, but you'll be able to train stealth, sneak up on people, and stab them. Your pact weapon would be a big ol' sword carved form pure eldritch energy, which, as mentioned, is very metal. Going infernal Hexblade will give you fire stuff, going fey will give you ice. I recommend Fey because the secondary focus on dexterity will make your sneakiness better. You can also multiclass assassin and pick up the cursed shadow feat to get Shadow Walk.

 

[Mentat55]

Re: Versatile Duelist, it does specifically let you do Sneak Attack with a one-handed heavy blade AND let you use rogue powers that require a light blade.

I will echo that hexblade sounds like a good fit. If you want a bit more magic and are dead set on Sneak Attack, a rogue|warlock hybrid would work pretty well. You'd have Sneak Attack, Warlock's Curse (another damage boosting mechanic), and a mix of powers usable with weapons alongside magical ranged or AOE attacks.

 

[Nemesis Destiny]

Re: Versatile Duelist, it does specifically let you do Sneak Attack with a one-handed heavy blade AND let you use rogue powers that require a light blade.

Right you are, I missed that. Last time I tried it on a build, it was with a Thief, and it did not show sneak attack working on the basic attack, but that could be an error in the builder. Either that, or the builder doesn't consider the Dex-based basic attack as a rogue power for purposes of the feat.

Benefit: You gain proficiency with all one-handed, military heavy blades. If a rogue power requires you to wield a light blade, you can use that power with a one-handed heavy blade and can also deal your Sneak Attack damage while using a one-handed heavy blade with that power.

The wording is iffy. If a dex-based MBA counts as a rogue power, then it works just fine. Emphasis added.

 

[Nahat Anoj]

I'll echo the other posters who recommend hexblades.

Sneak Attack?
They don't sneak attack like a rogue, but they do a bit of extra damage each time they attack that could be fluffed as zeroing in on weakness.

Thief Skills?
Hexblades have high Charismas, so they'll be able to Bluff well. In addition, they can train Stealth and Thievery - a fey pact hexblade would have the high Dexterity to be especially good in those.

If you want to be really good at disguise, a changeling has the stats to be a great hexblade.

Heavy Weapons?
The main weapon of a hexblade is, well, their hexblade, which can appear to be anything. Infernal pact hexblades have the baddest weapon, but fey pact hexblades aren't chopped liver.

Elemental Spells?
Yes, the hexblade's got them. You can cast elemental spells on your hexblade, and can shoot out blasts of fire and energy using various spells and Eldritch Blast.

I went and made up a quick character on the CB. It's not optimized or anything, but it has great thief skills, can do a lot of elemental blasts, wields a nasty blade (blade of winter's mourning), and the feat I chose is kind of like the rogue's first strike ability. It would do well in the games I run. This character isn't a heavy duty frontliner, but he's sneaky and can hit pretty hard - blade of winter mourning is at a +7 to hit AC and does 1d10+8 cold damage - as a basic melee attack! If you hit with it, you get a +2 bonus to your attacks against the target.

====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&D Character Builder ======
Hars, level 1
Changeling, Hexblade
Pact: Fey Pact

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
STR 10, CON 12, DEX 18, INT 10, WIS 10, CHA 18

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
STR 10, CON 12, DEX 16, INT 10, WIS 10, CHA 16


AC: 16 Fort: 12 Ref: 14 Will: 16
HP: 24 Surges: 7 Surge Value: 6

TRAINED SKILLS
Arcana +5, Bluff +11, Stealth +9, Thievery +9

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +4, Athletics +0, Diplomacy +4, Dungeoneering +0, Endurance +1, Heal +0, History +0, Insight +2, Intimidate +4, Nature +0, Perception +0, Religion +0, Streetwise +4

POWERS
Basic Attack: Melee Basic Attack
Basic Attack: Ranged Basic Attack
Changeling Racial Power: Changeling Disguise
Changeling Racial Power: Changeling Trick
Warlock Utility: Soul Step
Warlock Attack: Icy Skewer
Warlock Attack: Piercing Shard
Warlock Attack 1: Eldritch Bolt
Warlock Attack 1: Hellfire Blast

FEATS
Level 1: Aggressive Advantage

ITEMS
Blade of winter's mourning x1
Adventurer's Kit
Rod Implement x1
Leather Armor x1
====== End ======

 

[sigfile]

The wording is iffy. If a dex-based MBA counts as a rogue power, then it works just fine.

If true, this opens up Daggermaster to Thieves.