Blog (A5E) A Sneak Peek At Magic

In this article, we're going to take a look at some of the changes to spells and magic in Level Up. Most of these changes are ease-of-use changes for clarity, but there are some minor structural changes. We'll use fireball as an example of a spell while discussing these changes. Note that this is early in the design process for this part of the game, so things might yet change, and your feedback as always will affect that.

---

Fireball​

3rd-level (evocation, arcane, fire)
Classes: Sorcerer, wizard
Casting Time: 1 action
Range: Long (120 feet)
Area: 20-foot-radius sphere
Components: V, S, M (bat guano and sulfur)
Duration: Instantaneous
Saving Throw: Dexterity half

A fiery mote streaks to a point within range and explodes in a burst of flame. The fire spreads around corners and ignites unattended flammable objects. Each creature in the area takes 6d6* fire damage.

Cast at Higher Levels. The damage increases by 1d6 for each spell level over 3rd.

Rare: Ravjahani’s Blackfire. This spell’s silent black flames deal necrotic damage and don’t damage objects or leave marks on bodies. Any nonmagical flames in the area are extinguished. The spell has no vocalized component.

Rare: Katrina’s Improved Fireball. The fireball deals 8d6 fire damage.

---

Schools of Magic​

The first thing you might notice are the words under the spell name. For fireball, those words are evocation and fire. These are the schools of magic to which fireball beyonds.

Wait! I hear you say. Fire isn't a school of magic! Well, this is the first of our changes. The 8 classical schools of magic, as defined by wizards long past and handed down in formal tradition, all exist as you know them: evocation, divination, necromancy, and so on.

But that formal classification isn't the only way magic-users throughout the ages have labelled spells. In the multiverse there is a near-infinite array of spell schools; some are based on elemental sources (like fire, water, shadow, plants, beasts, and so on), while others are based on effects (healing, compulsion, and more).

The classical schools are rigidly defined; a spell can only belong to one classical school. Other schools are not as strict, however; a spell can belong to multiple non-classical schools. These schools are a tool which you can use to create spell lists, whether they be classical schools, or you want to give that red dragon access to all fire spells, or you need to simply list all fire spells in order to plan the spell choices of your fire-themed sorcerer. They're there to use as you wish.

In addition to the eight classical schools, Level Up contains the following list of magical schools: acid, affliction, air, arcana, attack, beasts, chaos, cold, communication, control, displacement, divine, earth, enhancement, evil, fear, fire, force, good, healing, knowledge, law, lightning, movement, nature, necrotic, negation, obscurement, planar, plants, poison, prismatic, protection, psychic, radiant, scrying, senses, shadow, shapechanging, sound, storm, summoning, technological, teleportation, terrain, thunder, transformation, utility, water, weaponry, weather.

Let's look at a couple of other spells and how they're classified.

Fire shield -- 4th-level (evocation, arcane, cold, fire, protection)

Locate creature -- 4th-level (divination, arcane, divine, beasts, plants, knowledge)

Sleet storm -- 2nd-level (conjuration, arcane, nature, cold, nature, weather)

Spell Stats​

You'll see that the spell has more information in the stat block up top. This give you lots of information about the spell at a glance. You might also notice that spell ranges have been standardized; common distances include short range (30 feet or less), medium range (60 feet or less), or long range (120 feet or less), as well as self, touch, and special ranges.

The components entry has changed slightly, too. V,S,M are used in the same way, but their meanings have been expanded to Vocalized, Seen, and Material. Different spell casters may cast spells differently -- a Vocalized spell is apparent to creatures that can hear, but might be a bard's song, a wizard's incantation, or even a musical instrument.

We make mention of material spell components to add flavor to the game, but if there is no price listed for those components, they are simply considered part of your spellcasting pouch.

Rare Spells​

One fun thing we're introducing is the concept of rare spells. Not all spells have rare versions. You can't choose rare spells out of the rulebook; you have to find them. They might be found in a treasure hoard, or in the depths of an ancient library; a rare spell might be the motivation for a quest. These rare spells -- which are all named after a famous spellcaster -- are better than the 'regular' versions, and are highly sought after. If you know a rare spell, you can memorize it instead of the regular version.

New Spells​

Of course, we have a whole bunch of new spells to add to those in the core rulebook, but you’ll have to wait to see those!


*Let us know what you think of the 6d6 fire damage! We haven't changed most spells fundamentally (other than clarity rewrites) but this is one of a few that we're considering.

Continue reading...

 

[TwoSix]

In the podcast yesterday it got mentioned that the rare spells are given out by the gm & not something a PC can just choose. That works easy with a spellbook, not so much with a set of spells known That's why I asked abour spell known classes.
They don't need to nerf all the spells just bring the deliberately overepowered spells in line & give casters ways of specializing lie we saw in sorcerer that allows other options. Unfortunately we only have the blaster & a specific debuff example & by default concentration still hamstrings niche roles that were viable pre-5e so we don't know what else to expect yet

My assumption would be that if the DM gives out a rare spell, a spells known caster would be able to immediately replace the old version with the new version. Alternatively, learning a rare spell might simply be more of a boon, expanding the spells known caster's total repertoire of spells.

 

[tetrasodium]

My assumption would be that if the DM gives out a rare spell, a spells known caster would be able to immediately replace the old version with the new version. Alternatively, learning a rare spell might simply be more of a boon, expanding the spells known caster's total repertoire of spells.

Do you also assume that there is a zero cost for a wizard to scribe spells to their spellbook, or is bypassing limitations of the class mechanics just for charisma based casters?

 

[TwoSix]

Do you also assume that there is a zero cost for a wizard to scribe spells to their spellbook, or is bypassing limitations of the class mechanics just for charisma based casters?

I tend to handwave the cost, so essentially yes. From my perspective, if I as a DM give out new spells that's functionally just like giving out a magic item or a boon. Giving out magic items isn't a player-facing option, in the sense that the player has to make choices between multiple options (if I gave you a wand of fire, you don't have the option to pick a wand of magic missiles instead), so there aren't really any balancing build concerns for the player. (Obviously, there's attunement, but almost all PCs have the same options there.)

There's no possible way to make any one magic item absolutely equitable between every PC option, rare magic spells are no different. Depending on the rules given, either wizards or known casters will have a slight advantage when using them (and clerics and druids will be the best).

 

[tetrasodium]

I tend to handwave the cost, so essentially yes. From my perspective, if I as a DM give out new spells that's functionally just like giving out a magic item or a boon. Giving out magic items isn't a player-facing option, in the sense that the player has to make choices between multiple options (if I gave you a wand of fire, you don't have the option to pick a wand of magic missiles instead), so there aren't really any balancing build concerns for the player. (Obviously, there's attunement, but almost all PCs have the same options there.)

There's no possible way to make any one magic item absolutely equitable between every PC option, rare magic spells are no different. Depending on the rules given, either wizards or known casters will have a slight advantage when using them (and clerics and druids will be the best).

That leads to another problem though. Specifically defaulting to giving rare spells on items. Both sorcerer/warlock/scorlock/scorlockadin & wizard can use it exactly the same, but the wizard has a costly & unused if not unusable class feature. You only need to look at the scarcity of spellbooks in general & spellbooks before the cammpaign is wrapping up vrs wand of x in wotc's HC adventures as evidence of how easy it is. If alice is playing a wizard while bob & chuck a sorcerer or warlock, she's going to notice that all of the rare spells are ignoring her ability to scribe spells to her spellbook pretty quickly & that's why I suggested being able to do a nondestructive copy from magic items to a spellbook earlier.

Te fact that without guidance not every gm will be doing the same handwave scribe costs only makes it worse

 

[Grantypants]

The wizard has a costly & unused if not unusable class feature.

Good point. Obviously this depends on what the Level Up Wizard looks like, but if every spellcaster can find improved versions of their spells, that kinda steps on the toes of an otherwise Wizard-specific class feature.

If your party has a wizard and a sorcerer, would both characters be able to learn Ravjahni's Blackfire? Or would the spell be consumed in some way by being learned? What if it was a different spell available to wizards and clerics, for example? Would that make a difference?

 

[TwoSix]

That leads to another problem though. Specifically defaulting to giving rare spells on items. Both sorcerer/warlock/scorlock/scorlockadin & wizard can use it exactly the same, but the wizard has a costly & unused if not unusable class feature. You only need to look at the scarcity of spellbooks in general & spellbooks before the cammpaign is wrapping up vrs wand of x in wotc's HC adventures as evidence of how easy it is. If alice is playing a wizard while bob & chuck a sorcerer or warlock, she's going to notice that all of the rare spells are ignoring her ability to scribe spells to her spellbook pretty quickly & that's why I suggested being able to do a nondestructive copy from magic items to a spellbook earlier.

<shrug>

I guess I've just never seen the issue. I've never had a wizard in my games so starved of resources they didn't copy every spell they stumbled upon into their spellbooks. Giving out spellbooks or meeting up with other people with spellbooks and gaining spells is pretty common in my games. The difference between a sorcerer learning the spell for free or the wizard spending a few hundred gp to scribe it is pretty trivial, in my experience.

Te fact that without guidance not every gm will be doing the same handwave scribe costs only makes it worse

I probably differ from most in that I view adapting to the DM's personal idiosyncrasies with your character choices as just another facet of skilled play. Don't play a wizard if the DM is overly stingy.

 

[tetrasodium]

Good point. Obviously this depends on what the Level Up Wizard looks like, but if every spellcaster can find improved versions of their spells, that kinda steps on the toes of an otherwise Wizard-specific class feature.

If your party has a wizard and a sorcerer, would both characters be able to learn Ravjahni's Blackfire? Or would the spell be consumed in some way by being learned? What if it was a different spell available to wizards and clerics, for example? Would that make a difference?

If the learned spells class is learning it through something like the sorcerer crystals in TCoE it's probably going to be smething they need to keep using just like if they are using a wand for it rather than "learning" it even if that wand is allowing them to use their own spell slots. I don't believe the analysis & resulting scribing of the spell should be consumed by a wizard scribing it to their spellbook even if they are scribing it from a scroll but I've seen tables do differently in the past under that circumstance of a scroll.

Even if it says that a wizard can spend one day of analysis per spell level with a magic item to scribe the associated spell from a magic item capable of casting a spell with rare spells being two per spell level that's a huge boon for wizards over 5e's pray you find a spellbook early enough to care

@TwoSix your comment about "Don't play a wizard if the DM is overly stingy" is oddly strange given that your position is to ignore the rules & allow scribing spells for free. In past editions you had things like

Spoiler: this] from3.5 phb175 [ATTACH type="full

129449[/ATTACH]

while in 5e we have the HC adventures from wotc making spellbooks rare as hens teeth & typically not found until very late in the adventure if not from killing the final big bad. All the platinum in the world doesn't do a wizard any good if they don't have anything to scribe.

 

[TwoSix]

@TwoSix your comment about "Don't play a wizard if the DM is overly stingy" is oddly strange given that your position is to ignore the rules & allow scribing spells for free.

Nothing odd about it. "Don't sweat scribing costs" would be my recommendation from one DM to another, but I recognize that not all DMs play like me. If you're playing with a DM that is resource-strict, don't play a class that requires more resources. Just like if you're playing with a DM that's stingy on short rests, don't play a warlock or monk.

 

[tetrasodium]

Nothing odd about it. "Don't sweat scribing costs" would be my recommendation from one DM to another, but I recognize that not all DMs play like me. If you're playing with a DM that is resource-strict, don't play a class that requires more resources. Just like if you're playing with a DM that's stingy on short rests, don't play a warlock or monk.

No not really because those same HC adventures I cited tend to be strict enough that the wizard is not going to be swimming in gold if they are only taking a share of the treasure. Wotc set the tage for failure in too many ways too often to blame the GM for this subset of the 5e wizard's faults

 

[jmucchiello]

There are DMs whose method of play favors and disfavors certain classes. It has always been this way. You don't play a 1e/2e thief with Bill because he'll never let you backstab.