D&D 3E/3.5 A thought on salvaging 3e feats for 5e use

[Li Shenron]

In another thread in the House Rules forum, I'm writing down my thoughts about how to create a D&DNext conversion of my favourite oriental setting (Rokugan).

I'm doing the conversion from the d20 version of Rokugan, which was unpopular (Rokugan has its own Legend of the Five Rings RPG) but it's the only one I have.

There are a lot of 3e feats in those d20 Rokugan books. My first thought was, that I will have to convert all those small 3e feats into large 5e feats, mostly by merging them by the 2-3, and removing (or changing) feats that are not generally appropriate for D&DNext (especially feats which go against bounded accuracy).

Then the following came to me, and it's not really related to Rokugan, it's an idea that can work with any 3e feat, therefore I thought maybe it's worth discussing and hearing your opinion about it!

Here it is in a nutshell...

Every time your 5e character can acquire a feat or +1 to two ability scores, you can choose any of the following options:

- gain a 5e feat
- gain +1 to two ability scores
- gain two 3e feats
- gain +1 to one ability score and one 3e feat


If this is balanced enough, you can re-use tons of 3e feats in 5e, as long as the specific feat benefit is acceptable for 5e.

What do you think?

 

[Kinak]

That sounds about right.

But it depends on both the 5e designers and the 3e designers getting feat balance right. We can't say about the 5e designers, but 3e feats were all over the map.

I don't say that as a dig on either edition's design. It's basically an impossible task, so falling short of the mark isn't something to be ashamed of.

Anyway, in the long run, I think you'll probably be better off designing new feats based on the 3e ones. Then you have the benefit of experience to mix them together properly, because some 3e feats are whole 5e feats and others are tiny fractions.

Cheers!
Kinak

 

[Li Shenron]

The 5e feats are also "all over the map" if you mean that there is quite a wild range of balance among them... 5e characters get less of them however, compared to 3e, so the difference between a PC with all the weakest feats and a PC with all the best ones, might be less.

Anyway the idea here is to re-use feats from 3e books, but it doesn't have to mean to allow a 5e player to freely pick any 3e feat! At the very least, a 3e feat needs to be checked that it doesn't go against bounded accuracy or is simply not applicable because it refers to rules that don't exist anymore or work differently. This is enough to guarantee that each 3e feat has to be checked by the DM before allowing a player to take it.

For Rokugan, there will be no official conversion to 5e, so my only option if I want to play with 5e rules in that setting, is to make a conversion myself. I'm looking for ideas to minimize the effort Generic 3e feats are not probably needed, since there will be 5e feats covering similar generic ideas, but perhaps someone else wants to convert another setting or simply to re-use a favourite 3e sourcebook.

 

[Jeff Carlsen]

Personally, if I were going to play in Rokugan, I'd hunt down a copy of The Legend of the Five Rings RPG, which has a fascinating mechanical flavor.

That said, this topic is really about feats, and the basics of what you're saying would appeal to a lot of people. You'd want to go through and cherry pick acceptable feats from 3E, but it could be made to work.

I'm more interested in merging and converging 3E feats, or using them for inspiration, because I prefer the larger 5E feats.

 

[Blackbrrd]

Sounds like a good house rule to me.

 

[Warskull]

I don't really think this will improve 5e. 3/3.5 feats were designed for 3.5. The introduce a lot more small +1s to track which to a degree is the antithesis of 5e. Plus, we haven't seen the full array of 5e feats. Mixing editions is one of the fastest ways to wreck your game.

 

[Li Shenron]

I don't really think this will improve 5e. 3/3.5 feats were designed for 3.5. The introduce a lot more small +1s to track which to a degree is the antithesis of 5e. Plus, we haven't seen the full array of 5e feats. Mixing editions is one of the fastest ways to wreck your game.

The point is not to improve 5e, but to use existing material. In my case (converting to 5e a fantasy setting that's not going to be published in 5e version) this saves me a lot of work. In someone else's case it might be an easy way to convert a 3e character into 5e. Or just a way to extend usefulness for books you paid for, at least temporarily before the same concepts are updated and published for 5e.

I explained that this idea is not to be used as a general rule, i.e. you shouldn't tell your players they can just pick any 3e feats and use them in a 5e game. It is not a player's rule. Instead, it is a DM's rule, or guideline for porting 3e feats into their own 5e game. But the DM still has to decide which feats are in. Clearly, a lot of feats which simply grant a numerical bonus are not appropriate for 5e, especially if they stack.

 

[ren1999]

If this is balanced enough, you can re-use tons of 3e feats in 5e, as long as the specific feat benefit is acceptable for 5e.

What do you think?

I really like it. What if we had a game where you could learn all possible feats at 20th level.
Or you could learn all the spells in your class by 20th level!

There is really no issue of balance here if the feats and spells roughly do the same damage. There are simply more options for veteran players. More options keep the game vibrant and interesting.