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D&D Older Editions
Abstracting Wealth in 4e: good idea or bad idea?
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<blockquote data-quote="(Psi)SeveredHead" data-source="post: 5683531" data-attributes="member: 1165"><p>D20 Modern has an abstract Wealth system, and it has some problems you'll want to avoid. Some seem to have been avoided in the above proposed system already.</p><p></p><p>Some PCs will want to adventure for wealth. They'll need to see a concrete increase in their station. They will <em>also</em> need to be spending money somehow (wealth sinks), which was something Modern was missing. (Once you had a wealth value of 14+, only items of 15+ ever cost you any wealth. Food cost nothing, and there were no maintenance or lifestyle costs.) This has little to do with game balance and much to do with motivation; once you're wealthy, why are you still adventuring? There's no such thing as a skilled private detective barely staying afloat. By contrast, it's easy to keep a DnD PC poor, while giving them the illusion they can be wealthy if they keep adventuring.</p><p></p><p>(D20 Modern made gaining wealth absurdly easy. The Profession skill simply gave you cash, and you didn't even need to go to work to get it. Employed heroes don't have time to be, well, working, unless adventuring is their job -- I suspect all playtested d20 Modern groups involved Department 7, which helps with the motivation anyway. *Sigh* And you couldn't lose wealth easily. There were very few things worth spending wealth on other than cars, and once you had a few expensive items that was it. You didn't lose wealth to taxes, rent or even medical care, since which group didn't have someone with Surgery?</p><p></p><p>Of course, at 1st-level, no one could afford anything but a gun and basic body armor. You had to take the bus, or steal cars. From my PoV this was a feature, not a bug, as I hate having to deal with vehicle combat, and it gets even worse if the PC group has more than one vehicle.)</p><p></p><p>An abstract wealth system does not work with game balance (at least not the way Modern did it). Since Modern didn't have worthwhile wealth sinks outside of FX-heavy settings, this was generally irrelevant. (In d20 Future, where you could bribe your way to victory, it caused massive balance problems if the GM wasn't stringent.) Use an inherent bonus system. Freed from being <strong>required</strong> to buy items, PCs can instead invest their wealth. Also note that some groups (or DMs, or some players in a group, etc) will not want to play a business game, which can be avoided by having PCs blow all their cash on magic items (or consumables like ale and something that will offend Eric's grandma).</p><p></p><p>I see why a lot of DMs don't like magic shops, preferring PCs find their items and spend their money on other things. In 3.x I believe they were required for game balance (to the point where I avoided games without them), but so far there's been none in my 4e campaign (it uses inherent bonuses) and I don't miss them at all. ^^</p><p></p><p>TLDR:</p><p></p><p>Have a maintenance cost system. This is for RP more than game balance, but you need to make getting rich difficult.</p><p></p><p>Decide on how magic items are purchased. If they can't be purchased, use inherent bonuses.</p><p></p><p>Determine if your PCs will turn into businessmen or not under such a system, and whether that's a good idea.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="(Psi)SeveredHead, post: 5683531, member: 1165"] D20 Modern has an abstract Wealth system, and it has some problems you'll want to avoid. Some seem to have been avoided in the above proposed system already. Some PCs will want to adventure for wealth. They'll need to see a concrete increase in their station. They will [i]also[/i] need to be spending money somehow (wealth sinks), which was something Modern was missing. (Once you had a wealth value of 14+, only items of 15+ ever cost you any wealth. Food cost nothing, and there were no maintenance or lifestyle costs.) This has little to do with game balance and much to do with motivation; once you're wealthy, why are you still adventuring? There's no such thing as a skilled private detective barely staying afloat. By contrast, it's easy to keep a DnD PC poor, while giving them the illusion they can be wealthy if they keep adventuring. (D20 Modern made gaining wealth absurdly easy. The Profession skill simply gave you cash, and you didn't even need to go to work to get it. Employed heroes don't have time to be, well, working, unless adventuring is their job -- I suspect all playtested d20 Modern groups involved Department 7, which helps with the motivation anyway. *Sigh* And you couldn't lose wealth easily. There were very few things worth spending wealth on other than cars, and once you had a few expensive items that was it. You didn't lose wealth to taxes, rent or even medical care, since which group didn't have someone with Surgery? Of course, at 1st-level, no one could afford anything but a gun and basic body armor. You had to take the bus, or steal cars. From my PoV this was a feature, not a bug, as I hate having to deal with vehicle combat, and it gets even worse if the PC group has more than one vehicle.) An abstract wealth system does not work with game balance (at least not the way Modern did it). Since Modern didn't have worthwhile wealth sinks outside of FX-heavy settings, this was generally irrelevant. (In d20 Future, where you could bribe your way to victory, it caused massive balance problems if the GM wasn't stringent.) Use an inherent bonus system. Freed from being [b]required[/b] to buy items, PCs can instead invest their wealth. Also note that some groups (or DMs, or some players in a group, etc) will not want to play a business game, which can be avoided by having PCs blow all their cash on magic items (or consumables like ale and something that will offend Eric's grandma). I see why a lot of DMs don't like magic shops, preferring PCs find their items and spend their money on other things. In 3.x I believe they were required for game balance (to the point where I avoided games without them), but so far there's been none in my 4e campaign (it uses inherent bonuses) and I don't miss them at all. ^^ TLDR: Have a maintenance cost system. This is for RP more than game balance, but you need to make getting rich difficult. Decide on how magic items are purchased. If they can't be purchased, use inherent bonuses. Determine if your PCs will turn into businessmen or not under such a system, and whether that's a good idea. [/QUOTE]
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