Academic Life?

[Notmousse]

I've been playing with the idea of allowing the teaching of skills I believe are important, but are often underrepresented in games.

Thus attending classes at a university is an acceptable way to increase craft, knowledge, and profession skills.

What would you do with this idea?

 

[Nifft]

Do you mean that PCs could spend gold at a University and gain skill points above & beyond what they'd normally be allowed?

Cheers, -- N

 

[Notmousse]

Personally I was thinking a competence bonus so that anyone wanting to do so would still need actual ranks for PrCs, and could overrun the skill cap in this way. Though I may allow actual skill points since it is limited to three oft overlooked skills.

 

[avigor]

I'd say make the actual ranks cost 2x the competence bonus, and be limited to the maximum for their current level. I'd also suggest making the cost go up by an extra 10% if you go beyond the normal cross-class skill maximum. So a level 5 character can't go above 8 total actual ranks, be they from level-ups or study, but could get a higher total ability higher via the competence bonus.

I'd also consider putting a max limit on the competence bonus; somewhere between level-5 and level+5. You might even want to replace level with skill ranks in the above equations. I don't think a level one player with a craft skill of 1 rank and a competence bonus of +40 makes sense, myself.

Otherwise, it sounds good to me.

 

[Nifft]

I like the idea of a competence bonus. What kind of prices would you set?

A +2 bonus to one Perform would be worth ... 50 gp? Same as a Masterwork instrument?

For Craft and Profession, the same I'd guess ... whatever the price is for Masterwork tools.

Cheers, -- N

 

[Notmousse]

I'm entertaining the idea of allowing classes to grant actual skill points or circumstance bonuses like avigor suggest, but I'm curious about how to present that in game. Perhaps attending a class vs apprenticing?

Costs is my main sticking point. The SRD values skills at (bonus^2)*100 when applied to magic items which just seems ridiculous as you find yourself spending the town's GDP after a few classes. I was thinking more along the lines of either 100*bonus, or (bonus^2)*10

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

Interesting idea..

For cost, given that 5gp = 1 xp and that '+2 Masterwork' for a skill = 50gp, perhaps:

+1 competance bonus to a skill costs 10 xp {double masterwork cost since its not 'stealable'}
+2 costs 30 xp { 10 + 20}
+3 costs 60 xp {10 + 20 + 30}
etc...

However, teaching is not a sure thing. It depends on both the instructor and the student... so, a new skill: Teaching {WIS, trained only}

The DC of the Teaching check = the students skill level {ranks + bonuses}. For each 5 points over the DC, the student gains a +1 to thier Learning check. You cannot teach a skill unless you have more ranks than they have skill level.

To learn the skill, the student must pass an INT. The DC of this check = intended skill level {ranks + bonuses}. Beating the DC allows the student to learn a thing or two.

It takes a time equal to the students current skill level in months in order to teach them. In this manner Joe, having 5 ranks in Knowledge Arcana and an INT bonus of +2, must spend 7 months in training. At the end of this training he and his teacher roll thier checks. If he beats the DC he must pay the XP in order to gain the skill bonus.

Additionally: The teacher may demand payment, which will vary based on a number of things. Universities, Guild membership, or Noble houses may get 'free' training. Gold pieces or service{apprenticeship} may be common.


Lastly. the Training skill. Not everyone is a Teacher. In the real world it only takes a bit of talent and perseverance to teach. We don't want to make a system that is a virtual free ticket to PC's teaching each other and getting massive skills, but we want the option for a PC to become a Teacher to exist. Hence:
Feat: Sensai (General)
You gain access to the Teaching skill as a class skill. You can train others in skills you have learned. You can earn a living teaching as outlined in the Profession skill.


Note: With this system, it only takes a Feat and Skill point for alot of low level training. Characters can easily train at skill levels. As the characters gain ranks, it becomes harder and harder to learn anything from a Teacher.
You still have costs associated {Time invested, XP cost, and possible GP cost}, but the majority of the Teachers will still be NPC's working at Universities. Everyone else will stick to the common process of earning XP through the trade and level up.

Sidenote: This could allow for some interesting additions to the world setting as Nobles and Guild Members may have a higher skill at a particular thing. This would make a mechancial reason why Guild craftsmen are better...free Competance training... and would expand the abilities of the aristo's.

Not a bad idea.. someone want to snipe at my SWAG of the XP costs?

 

[Notmousse]

I was thinking GP and time costs as I don't like the idea of XP costs outside of item creation and spellcasting, doubly so when XP often comes from killing things instead of doing things (like practing skills).

 

[Primitive Screwhead]

I was thinking XP cost as an investment of the character..lets the poor broke orphan link up with the great teacher and follow him around learning... stuff like that.

XP should also come from 'practicing skills', fer instance you could say that earning enough to make a living via the Profession skill is a CR 1/2 encounter. In this manner those merchants out there can gain a level or two of an NPC class.

I like the idea of a training mechanic, but think the normal broad brush of gain a level = gain skill points suffices for the most part. The problem comes in when you have universities. Unless you want to grant normal XP for attending class or come up with a 'student' base class... the best method is to allow the purchase of competance points.

I would prefer the triple costs of Gold, Time, and XP for this, making it more of a choice than when the winter wind comes in blocking all travel..
Dwark says, hey, we aren't going anywhere for 4 months...break out the brew!
Human says, hey, I don't drink...but I am going to head over to the schoolhouse and spend whatever extra change I have to learn more skillz!

With an XP cost, gaining skills may slow his progression up, so its a bit more of a real trade.


And actually, I agree. XP costs tend to run into interesting problems, but its part of the resources characters have in the rules.

 

[Mistwell]

I think this is a fine idea, and may snag it for my currently defunct Mistwell University campaign.