accidentally hitting grabber instead of grabbee?

[bluetshirt]

hi folks,

i got a question about grabbing. are there rules that describe accidental damage to the grabber in case of attacks directed towards the creature being grabbed? i've had to wing it a few times because i just can't find an appropriate rule, though i've heard others reference such a thing. any help would be much appreciated.

thanks,
bts

 

[FireLance]

Generally, in 4E, there is no chance of hitting the grabber when you target the grabee (or vice-versa). That said, there are monsters such as the bugbear strangler who are able to redirect an attack made against them to a creature that they have grabbed. However, these are special abilities of the individual creatures, and not a general rule.

 

[bluetshirt]

okey doke then. much obliged!

 

[the Jester]

This was a rule for ranged attacks into a grapple in 3e, but in 4e there's no such rule.

4e has really done away with friendly fire in almost all cases (except for area and close attacks, sometimes). I'm not sure I like this, but so it is.

 

[Infiniti2000]

Fwiw, accidentally hitting the 'cover' is also gone. Isn't it?

 

[StormCrow42]

Fwiw, accidentally hitting the 'cover' is also gone. Isn't it?

Yes. AFAIK, there weren't official rules about that in 3E either, just a reduced hit chance. In 4E, enemies provide cover, but your allies do not.

 

[MrMyth]

One thing to keep in mind is that grabbing in 4E tends to less represent a total, full-body wrestling manuever, and is more to represent simply getting a firm grasp on someone to prevent them running away. There are certainly powers and monsters that have specific abilities that represent the 'complete grapple', or the ability to interpose a grabbed target between yourself and danger, but those are much less common.

 

[lukelightning]

I could picture a feat (or perhaps a skill utility power?) that says something like "when you are grabbed and are targeted by an attack vs. AC or reflex, you can redirect the attack to the creature grabbing you as an immediate interrupt (basically a reverse of the bugbear strangler maneuver). You'd probably have to word it so you can't force the grabbing creature to attack itself.

 

[the Jester]

Fwiw, accidentally hitting the 'cover' is also gone. Isn't it?

No, but it only applies to enemies providing cover to enemies.

Yes. AFAIK, there weren't official rules about that in 3E either, just a reduced hit chance.

I think there was something like: If you miss but would have hit if the target didn't have cover, you hit the cover (as long as your attack roll penetrates its AC).

 

[eamon]

I think there was something like: If you miss but would have hit if the target didn't have cover, you hit the cover (as long as your attack roll penetrates its AC).

Wasn't there some difference between 3e and 3.5 here, too? In any case, that does sound familiar ;-).