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Adapting the Lycanthrope Template to +0?

Trench

First Post
I'm starting a police procedural compaign in Ptolus (inspired by a thread at ENWorld actually...) starting at level 1 and one of the players *REALLY* would like to play a werewolf. And elf rogue lycanthrope to be exact (Yeah, someone read Elfquest growing up...) I initially said no straight out until he mentioned that he'd be willing to kill his character, have him raised and then have lycanthropy affect him afterward (Maybe after being killed by werewolves that work for a corrupt noble house). That got me thinking.

The problem is that the lycanthrope template is totally assinine. (Levels in player and animal HD? Guh?) The threads on ENWorld I read made it seem even more incomprehensible.

So, I downloaded this, which has a lot of excellent ideas and drasticaly simplifies the template. It's a great book, so if you like were-stuff get it.

Basically, no ability bonuses (besides what he'll get as an elf already). The darkvision is obviously a moot point, but the Scent ability is drastically reduced. 5 feet, 10 ft upwind, 0 ft downwind. Does not reveal the exact location, only the presence (so invisibility is still a threat). Tracking with scent only possible with the Track feat. They also gain the Alertness feat while in wereform. Any INT, CHA, many DEX skills (basically any skill that requres patience or concentration) are unusable in wereform without picking up another feat (and having a +3 Will save minimum at that...). Spells and magic items that require a trigger are impossible to use.

A lot of the typical lycanthrope abilities will only be gained by picking feats outlined in the book. Not sure if that would gimp a rogue or not. I haven't DM'ed 3.5 before.

There's also something called "Moon Hit Points" to circumvent the DR issue. Basically, you get temporary hit points while in were-form, but these HP are ignored by magic and silver entirely- taking it right off the main HP total. The book suggested 20 of them, but I may reduce it to 10 or 15.

On top of that, I may also add a 5/vulnerability to silver. Meaning that he'll take an extra five points of damage from any silver weapon. This'll mean a silver bullet could easily kill him straight out for a few levels. And given that the setting is very magic heavy and savvy (The City Watch has been trained to deal with weird stuff, and are issued silver weapons and bullets just in case. The crime families are also just as canny.) this may work.

I'm jettisoning the alignment restrictions, with one potential caveat. I'm thinking on full moon nights, he'll have to make a save of some sort or shift into wereform and or shift temporarilly to CE while in wereform. The likelyhood is that he'll just be chained into the basement of the Brotherhood of Redemption (a group dedicated to redeeming "evil" creatures). On nights when he can't it'll be interesting.

I'm debating the use of the Control Form skill. May be moot anyway, since he may go for natural lycanthrope.

Basically, I think the backstory is he's a natural lycanthrope runt (no ability bonuses, extra silver vulnerability, scent ability reduced by living in a city for so long) that was delivered to the Brotherhood as a cub by some adventurers. The alignment issue is circumvented, while still capturing some of the traditonal werewolf curse flavor.

So what do you think? I'm not overly familliar with adjusting for LA and all that, and yeah I'm kind of a new DM- but this seems like a good compromise to me.
 

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Seeten

First Post
Whats he gaining as a lycanthrope, under this? Scent that isnt scent, and what else?

Are other Lycanthropes going to be similarly gimped, or he just the wimpiest lycanthrope in the known world?
 

Deekin

Adventurer
See Eberron campaign setting, Races of Eberron, or the MM3. Look at the Shifter. It was created to be a LA 0 lycanthrope.
 

Trench

First Post
Seeten said:
Whats he gaining as a lycanthrope, under this? Scent that isnt scent, and what else?

Are other Lycanthropes going to be similarly gimped, or he just the wimpiest lycanthrope in the known world?

Well the ability to turn into a wolf or wereform is pretty big I think. As I said, lycanthropes will remain normal except for him.

The Shifter sounds interesting. I may look into that.
 


HeavenShallBurn

First Post
Relique du Madde said:
Sean K Renyolds produced a PDF called <link href="http://enworld.rpgnow.com/product_info.php?products_id=6960&"> Curse of the Moon </link> which talks about different ways you can change the lycanthrope template to become +0 LA racial class.

He's already got that, it's what he used to modify it in the ways he's proposing.
 

Relique du Madde

Adventurer
I think no matter what, it becomes a hard balancing act especially if you decide to use the silver vulnernability rule which would make were creatures very undesirable even with moon points in play ("Cool I have extra hp BUT what do you mean it doesn't count against magic and silver, butwhy the hell do do I get extra-damage from silver weapons?!?!"). On the plus side, silver vulnerability can possibly balance out one or two bonus abilities
 

Seeten

First Post
Trench said:
Well the ability to turn into a wolf or wereform is pretty big I think. As I said, lycanthropes will remain normal except for him.

The Shifter sounds interesting. I may look into that.

Why is the ability to turn into a wolf big? Arent wolves really weak compared to a level 1 fighter? And isnt the wereform gutted so it doesnt have DR or attribute adjustments?

Not to be harsh, but couldnt he get this effect with a changelings "Minor disguise" ability, in essence? There are werewolfisms that dont add to the effect, and others, like dr/silver that are 100% necessary. Stripping out the worthless stuff(Racial HD) from the Flavor(Dr/Silver, Regeneration) would be my first step. I'd move him towards a savage progression until he has an appropriate werewolf template, akin to the Libris Mortis progressions for vampires, and wights and ghouls.

The progression for vampire spawn gives DR 5/Silver&Magic at level 8, IIRC.
 

Trench

First Post
Well, to be fair, I don't think he cares about the horror-flavor. He just wants a wolfish elven girl that turns into a wolf and steals things. Again, I'm pretty sure he's heavily influenced by the Elfquest comics.

So really, the main LA killer is that bloody damage resistance and extra HP. So what happens, assuming he just wants the wolf part, if we just jettison any pretention of damage resitance and silver vulnerability at all? (heh. As suggested by the pdf... yeah, sorry guys, I tried to get fancy and got needlessly complicated instead). We could maybe even up the scent to good ol' regular scent to not make him too gimped.

I like the idea of a savage progression, but that would make him fall behind inthe whole rogue area.

Shifters are pretty neat though, just looking at them now.
 

Relique du Madde

Adventurer
I don't think there would be any major problem if you jettison the damage resistance and the silver vulnerablity. After all, when in wolf form is basically only cosmetic if you do not have the moon rage stat adjustments. I think that having scent only in the wolf form does balance out the inability to use weapons and most skills. But if you do think that this might be a little too powerful then you can put a x/day limiter that is based on pc's character level.

You may even use the savage progression for the character to pick up other lycanthrope abilities (he may only need to go up a total of three levels if you do not want to go the lycanthrope + animal level route)
 

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