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Advice wanted for DM'ing Crucible of the Gods


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Truename

First Post
So... yeah. I took Rechan's advice. I took it real good. Then I took it again.

Final tally: eight deaths, world drowned, -365 points scored. Spoileriffic details follow.

First, you have to know that my group is a fairly casual group. We've been playing WotBS for over a year, and we played the entire heroic tier of Scales of War before that, but none of us are hard-core D&D'ers. 4e is pretty much the extent of our adult tabletop gaming. Coming into the game, no one had studied the player's handout (and only one person had even read it). This adventure was about to hit them like a Mac truck. And I loved every minute of it.

The entrance brought us our first TPK.

I set the mood by reading the intro from the player's guide (since hardly any of them had read it!). They were appropriately leery of the skull in the entranceway arch. They saw that it was hinged and deciding to tie it shut to thwart a deathtrap. (snigger) Entering the Crucible, they found the eight keys, discovered they were fool's gold, and decided that since all the keys were the same, they might as well pick a portal at random and walk through. And so they did.

Crucible: 4; Players: 0. Elapsed time: 5 minutes.

I took 15 minutes off the timer and restarted the adventure. "You are humanity's greatest hope. Up until about five minutes ago, you were humanity's second greatest hope..."

On to the Great Hub.

They were cautious here, and learned what needed to be learned without any deaths. (I was also a bit nice and reminded the players of the gods' domains when describing the holy symbols on each door.) They almost put a normal skull on one of the pedestals, but then sensibly realized that, with four doors leading out of the hub, it probably wasn't that simple. Then they remembered their rumor about secrets, said they were searching for secret doors "on all the walls" (pointing at every single wall in the hub and corridors) and rolled a great perception check.

What the hell. Secrets a-plenty. They got the tablet in the niche and found the skeleton in the closet. They all did quite well with the dice, with two PCs getting lots of temporary hit points, one getting truesight, and the last losing a surge. They decided that, being strong, now would be a time to take on Kishar's trial.

Starting with the goddess of combat may not have been the best idea.

They go in, the door slams shut, and the hunter strides across the room to examine an obelisk up close. He of course goes right past the dracolisk's line of sight and triggers the encounter. One round later, he's petrified. The cleric had lots of opportunities to grant saves, but didn't realize it because he didn't know the character well enough. Then the cleric drops. Then the mage gets petrified. At this point, only the knight remains standing, thanks to some very bad dice rolls and his truesight. But at least they had figured out the secret to killing the dracolisk.

The fun level was dropping and people were getting frustrated, so I notched down the timer and allowed them to send in replacements. They kept the same characters for familiarity's sake, which I allowed for fun's sake. After a grueling battle, several more statues adorned the battlemat and the heroes were victorious! Knight, Hunter III, Warpriest II, and Mage III celebrated their victory by letting Hunter III touch the sarcophogus and turn into a snake.

Then they found the divine skull, picked it up, and got Mage III's soul sucked out of his body. Luckily, he made the saving throw, saving them the trouble of meeting Mage IV. The skull vanished. Forever, I helpfully told them.

Crucible: 8; Players: 0.

Back to the great hub and into Asar-Segt's challenge.

The timer had long since run out, but we had 30 minutes left in our normal timeslot, so we switched over to tournament rules for the fun of it. Asar-Segt is a pair of skill challenges and the weakest part of the adventure, in my opinion. I've never been good at running skill challenges, and there isn't a lot of dungeon dressing in Asar-Segt's room to build on.

Nonetheless, 25 minutes later, the incantation was complete, but the challenge to reconstruct the golem was botched. They were transported to the great hub to do battle...

...and that's when the gods drowned the world. The end. Final score: +35 for finding the two secret rooms. -400 for 8 deaths.

Despite the challenges, and some wondering aloud at how anybody could ever beat that combat, I think the players had fun. I'm sorry they didn't make it to the southeast corner, with the puzzles, as I think that's the strongest component of the dungeon. The skill challenge was my least favorite part, but I'm not sure how to improve it. We're likely to play it again next time we need a one shot.

Thanks, Sersa V, for a great evening!

Die and die,
And die again,
I drowned the world
Before night's end!
 


Yeah, well, cheer up. I think the chances of any uninitiated group getting to the final encounter in that module is 0. Maybe after 3-4 runthroughs, but I strongly doubt even my most hardened veteran players of 30 years would make it far. The thing is a total death gauntlet. Very well done though for what it is. The other couple FC modules I read through didn't really hit me as being as cleverly designed, though they certainly were all well written.
 

Evilhalfling

Adventurer
Knight, Hunter III, Warpriest II, and Mage III celebrated their victory by letting Hunter III touch the sarcophogus and turn into a snake.

rule #16: Don't turn into a snake. It never helps.

right 4th core. Its kinda all like that.
I used 1 trap from there designed for 2nd level characters. doubled the damage,
and turned the "stand in the wrong place and die" into "stand in the wrong place and.." make 2 saves, and be removed from the encounter. It worked fine for 12th level characters. They only lost 2.
 


Nullzone

Explorer
Yeah, well, cheer up. I think the chances of any uninitiated group getting to the final encounter in that module is 0. Maybe after 3-4 runthroughs, but I strongly doubt even my most hardened veteran players of 30 years would make it far. The thing is a total death gauntlet. Very well done though for what it is. The other couple FC modules I read through didn't really hit me as being as cleverly designed, though they certainly were all well written.

Not to brag, but uh, I did. Run by Sersa himself, no less. Call it random luck if you like (we were definitely guessing in at least two places; we had narrowed it down but had no way to know for sure if we were right), and managed to get to the last room even having failed the golem reconstruction (which actually ended my character, but as this was at a convention I was allowed to remain as a spirit entity that could at least talk to the party and convey ideas; I was telepathically linked to the party and could only see what they saw, I had no physical form or means to traverse the dungeon, so that prevented any notion of 'cheating').

We were going to die in the last chamber when our final party member struck a bargain with the avatar; we had clearly passed the trials and were worthy combatants, so the PC offered to become the avatar's eternal servant if he allowed the crucible to be rendered completed (thus saving the world).

He agreed. (I believe, though I haven't actually looked at the most updated text, that Sersa actually worked with him to add in this element, which is really cool!)

Both C1 and SND01 are completely doable without preknowledge, as long as you are inclined to think abstractly enough. The real-time clock makes that difficult though, so it's easy to (dis)miss a detail that would win you the day.
 

Not to brag, but uh, I did. Run by Sersa himself, no less. Call it random luck if you like (we were definitely guessing in at least two places; we had narrowed it down but had no way to know for sure if we were right), and managed to get to the last room even having failed the golem reconstruction (which actually ended my character, but as this was at a convention I was allowed to remain as a spirit entity that could at least talk to the party and convey ideas; I was telepathically linked to the party and could only see what they saw, I had no physical form or means to traverse the dungeon, so that prevented any notion of 'cheating').

We were going to die in the last chamber when our final party member struck a bargain with the avatar; we had clearly passed the trials and were worthy combatants, so the PC offered to become the avatar's eternal servant if he allowed the crucible to be rendered completed (thus saving the world).

He agreed. (I believe, though I haven't actually looked at the most updated text, that Sersa actually worked with him to add in this element, which is really cool!)

Both C1 and SND01 are completely doable without preknowledge, as long as you are inclined to think abstractly enough. The real-time clock makes that difficult though, so it's easy to (dis)miss a detail that would win you the day.

Sounds like some luck. I mean eventually someone is going to do it cold, but as you say, there are spots where you simply have to guess and EVERY wrong guess in the whole place is pretty close to an insta-gib for some character. It is very thematic and I really did like the way it was written. I just don't think that style of play is one that has a lot of replay value and isn't something you can use in an ongoing campaign (at least with groups that I play with). The 4C modules are in general nicely done pieces of work, but like ToH or other 'tournament' modules (White Plume Mtn comes to mind too) they're not super useful for general play. I'd really like to see some adventures that were equally well written but more useful for the average DM to drop into a game. Personally I don't mind some really thematic 'insta-gib' kinds of situations that are story driven etc but just laid on a bit less thick and more of them being "if you're sensible you should be able to avoid this" or amenable to some planning ahead. Still, C1 is one of the most fun looking and nicely done modules I've read in a long time. The whole atmosphere of the thing was really well executed.
 

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