Level Up (A5E) AG Maneuvers good for purely ranged characters

[W'rkncacnter]

so a common criticism i've seen of a5e's maneuvers is that, outside of biting zephyr obviously, there's not a lot of options for purely ranged characters. so, i went through every single maneuver in the AG (except for biting zephyr's, for obvious reasons) and recorded what weapons they were usable with - or if they didn't require a weapon, whether they were obviously melee focused (typically this meant either the maneuver was only usable within melee range, or else brought you into melee). below are my results (warning - it's a pretty long list of tables)!

Adamant Mountain​

Maneuver​	Weapon​
Catch Your Breath​	N/A​
Cleaving Swing​	Melee, Heavy​
Heavy Stance​	N/A​
Lean Into It​	Melee​
Reactive Knockdown​	Melee​
Shrug It Off​	N/A​
Warding Wield​	N/A​
Battering Strike​	Melee, Heavy​
Crushing Blow​	Melee, Heavy​
Unbreakable​	N/A​
Stand Tall Stance​	N/A​
Unstoppable​	N/A​
Wild Swing​	Melee, Heavy​
Unyielding​	N/A​
World-Shaking Strike​	Heavy​

Mirror's Glint​

Maneuver​	Weapon​
Knockdown Assault​	Melee​
Leading Throw​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Warning Strike​	Melee​
Wary Stance​	N/A​
Assisted Roll​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Off-Balancing Strikes​	Melee​
Take Weapon​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Flowing Form​	Melee​
Heightened Reflexes​	N/A​
Redirect​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Discerning Strike​	Any​
Retributive Strike​	Melee​
Strike the Cracks​	Melee​
Blinding Strikes​	Melee​
Reflect Attack​	N/A (works only in melee)​

Mist and Shade​

Maneuver​	Weapon​
Anticipate Spell​	Any (works only within 5 feet)​
Deceptive Stance​	N/A​
Painful Pickpocket​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Perplexing Fury​	Melee​
Agile Feint​	Any (works only in melee)​
Force Hesitation​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Mugging Hit​	Melee​
Douse​	Special (container of liquid)​
Feinting Strike​	Melee​
Pickpocket​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Blinding Blow Stance​	Melee​
Spinning Parry​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Steal Momentum​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Armor Lock​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Pilfer Object​	N/A (brings you into melee)​

Rapid Current​

Maneuver​	Weapon​
Charge​	Melee​
Eye Slash​	Melee​
Speed Over Strength​	Melee​
Swift Stance​	N/A​
Parrying Counter​	Melee​
Rapid Drink​	N/A​
Rolling Strike​	Melee​
Disarming Counter​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Rapid Strike​	Melee​
Whirlwind Strike​	Melee​
First Blood​	N/A​
Flowing Steps Stance​	N/A​
Whirlpool Strike​	Melee​
Tidal Parry​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Tsunami Dash​	Melee, dual-wielding or finesse​

Razor's Edge​

Maneuver​	Weapon​
Dangerous Strikes​	Any​
Exploit Footing​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Iron Will​	N/A​
Perceptive Stance​	N/A​
Practiced Roll​	N/A​
Twist the Blade​	Melee​
Use The Pain​	Melee​
Drive Back​	Melee​
Instinctive Counterattack​	Melee​
Mind Over Body​	N/A​
Dashing Razor​	Melee​
Perfect Edge Stance​	Any​
Sharpened Awareness​	Any​
Death Blow​	Melee​
Heightened Concentration​	N/A (why is there a 5th degree maneuver about concentration? Who’s gonna use this?????)​

Sanguine Knot​

Maneuver​	Weapon​
Doubleteam​	Melee​
Legion Stance​	Any (? works only in melee)​
Shield Wall​	N/A (requires shield)​
Shoulder Check​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Back To Back​	N/A​
Double Tackle​	N/A (brings into melee)​
Dual Grapple​	N/A (grappling)​
Follow-Up Topple​	Melee​
Hurl Ally​	Melee​
Look At Me!​	Melee​
Bodyguard​	N/A (works only in melee)​
Brotherhood Stance​	Melee​
Doubletime​	N/A​
Rallying Cry​	N/A​
United We Stand​	Melee​

Spirited Steed​

Maneuver​	Weapon​
Cavalier Stance​	N/A​
Lancer Strike​	Melee, Reach​
Mounted Charge​	Melee​
Riding Leap​	N/A​
Rearing Menace​	Any​
Spur Mount​	N/A​
Trample​	N/A (effects creatures in your way)​
Launched Strike​	Melee​
Sacrifice Mount​	N/A (bro don’t hurt the horse :c)​
Saddled Blows​	Melee​
Prodigious Leap​	N/A​
Spirited Whistle​	N/A​
Steely Steed Stance​	Melee​
Reassuring Pat​	N/A​
Wheeling Charge​	Melee​

Tempered Iron​

Maneuver​	Weapon​
Imposing Glare​	N/A​
Purge Magic​	Melee​
Striding Swings​	Any​
Zealous Stance​	Melee​
Faith Within​	N/A​
Gaze Of Conviction​	N/A (brings an enemy into melee)​
Stunning Assault​	Melee​
Break Spell​	Melee​
Defy Magic​	N/A​
Dispelling Assault​	Any​
Devoted Assault​	Any​
Disrupting Charge​	Melee​
Spell Shattering Strike​	Melee​
Branding Steel​	Melee​
Burning Embers of Faith​	N/A​

Tooth and Claw​

Maneuver​	Weapon​
Bounding Strike​	Melee​
Raking Strikes​	Melee​
Ride Enemy​	N/A (Grab On)​
Springing Stance​	N/A​
Expert Tumble​	N/A​
Leaping Strike​	Melee​
Primal Intercept​	Melee​
Gut Strike​	Any​
Rake​	Melee​
Wild Capering​	N/A​
Blind Instinct​	Melee​
Bloody Roar​	Melee​
Mercurial Striking Stance​	Natural Weapon OR Unarmed Strike OR Any, Dual-Wielding​
Furious Barrage​	Melee​
Wounded Animal Gambit​	Melee​

Unending Wheel​

Maneuver​	Weapons​
Dangerous Signature​	Melee​
Throwing Stance​	Any​
Victory Pose​	Any​
Wounding Strike​	Any​
Deflect Strike​	N/A​
Instant Strike​	Melee​
Preternatural Strikes​	Any​
Disarming Assault​	Melee​
Expert Sidestep​	N/A​
Unsettling Injury​	Melee​
Any Weapon Stance​	Any​
Mistaken Opportunity​	Melee​
Wind Strike​	Melee​
Heart of the Sword​	Any​
Perfect Assault​	Any​

 

[MehGyver]

The lawds work right here

 

[xiphumor]

Marvelous Work, first of all! Always here for data!

Second, would a better solution be to expand the range of options for ranged weapons available within Biting Zephyr, or within the rest of the traditions?

 

[foxblade]

Marvelous Work, first of all! Always here for data!

Second, would a better solution be to expand the range of options for ranged weapons available within Biting Zephyr, or within the rest of the traditions?

I think making a new tradition that does other things with ranged weapons would be cool, but expansion of others is probably the more do-able solution.


Some new ones that focus on different types of ranged weapons are neat too and they exist.
On these forums there is a gunfighter one, for example.
One that focuses on thrown weapons is something I am thinking of inventing as well (but we will see how that turns out - probably unnecessary)

 

[Stalker0]

Great list thank you!

From here you can further narrow it down. Some maneuvers for example, just aren't good (wounding strike), so even if you can take that with a bow, I would never want to.

And while others like Throwing stance or Striding Swings "technically" can be used with a ranged build, they really aren't that useful for one.

So that has been my experience watching my player's ranger gain levels and pick maneuvers. Once you reduce based on schools you know, then reduce based on maneuvers you actually can use with range, than further reduce based on maneuvers that are competent for ranged....there is just really slim pickings.

 

[Steampunkette]

I think making a new tradition that does other things with ranged weapons would be cool, but expansion of others is probably the more do-able solution.


Some new ones that focus on different types of ranged weapons are neat too and they exist.
On these forums there is a gunfighter one, for example.
One that focuses on thrown weapons is something I am thinking of inventing as well (but we will see how that turns out - probably unnecessary)

Because of this thread I'm working on two, now, for the Gate Pass Gazette. If it gets rejected, I'll just put it in my next book. Duskwood Sniper and Thundering Bombard.

Also I'm already planning another book even though the first kickstarter hasn't gone live, yet, because I just have so much writing I -can- do that I restrain myself from to preserve material for the GPG and other EN Publishing works in the hopes I'll get tapped to add stuff.

 

[W'rkncacnter]

Second, would a better solution be to expand the range of options for ranged weapons available within Biting Zephyr, or within the rest of the traditions?

my personal opinion is that the better solution of the two would be to expand the range of options in other traditions. biting zephyr has enough options for ranged characters (i mean, you COULD add more if you wanted as well, but it feels a bit redundant) - and i disagree with the design principle of having one tradition specifically for all of the ranged abilities since it means any martial wanting to focus on ranged combat will just have a largely dead tradition (or two, in the case of the fighter) in their pocket.

I think making a new tradition that does other things with ranged weapons would be cool, but expansion of others is probably the more do-able solution.

yeah, the more i think about it the more i think biting zephyr should have been split into at least two traditions - one for your marksman overwatch stuff (e.g. covering fire, farshot stance, etc.) and one for your more mobile trick stuff (e.g. point blank shot, countershot, etc.). it would've allowed each idea to be more fleshed out and given ranged characters some more options instead of just "well i guess i know literally this entire tradition now because nothing else was good for my character concept".

From here you can further narrow it down. Some maneuvers for example, just aren't good (wounding strike), so even if you can take that with a bow, I would never want to.

And while others like Throwing stance or Striding Swings "technically" can be used with a ranged build, they really aren't that useful for one.

So that has been my experience watching my player's ranger gain levels and pick maneuvers. Once you reduce based on schools you know, then reduce based on maneuvers you actually can use with range, than further reduce based on maneuvers that are competent for ranged....there is just really slim pickings.

i originally had comments on what i thought of the schools from the perspective of a ranged character, but it was 1-2 in the morning when i wrote this post up and they were sort of incoherent as a result, so i opted to not include them. i think just having posted the data was better anyways, having my opinions on each tradition within the original post may have ended up just getting in the way.

Because of this thread I'm working on two, now, for the Gate Pass Gazette. If it gets rejected, I'll just put it in my next book. Duskwood Sniper and Thundering Bombard.

 

[Sepulchre]

There is a Savant subclass, the Vanguard, that allows the use of melee tricks with ranger weapon attacks within 30 feet. Something similar could work as a house rule with some traditions, or as future subclass features or magic items.

Edit: An additional thought I had is that many melee maneuvers can already be used with a whip at 15ft. It does not seem unreasonable to me to allow the same “reach” with ranged weapon attacks while using melee maneuvers.

 

[scaramouche]

my personal opinion is that the better solution of the two would be to expand the range of options in other traditions. biting zephyr has enough options for ranged characters (i mean, you COULD add more if you wanted as well, but it feels a bit redundant) - and i disagree with the design principle of having one tradition specifically for all of the ranged abilities since it means any martial wanting to focus on ranged combat will just have a largely dead tradition (or two, in the case of the fighter) in their pocket.

yeah, the more i think about it the more i think biting zephyr should have been split into at least two traditions - one for your marksman overwatch stuff (e.g. covering fire, farshot stance, etc.) and one for your more mobile trick stuff (e.g. point blank shot, countershot, etc.). it would've allowed each idea to be more fleshed out and given ranged characters some more options instead of just "well i guess i know literally this entire tradition now because nothing else was good for my character concept".

i originally had comments on what i thought of the schools from the perspective of a ranged character, but it was 1-2 in the morning when i wrote this post up and they were sort of incoherent as a result, so i opted to not include them. i think just having posted the data was better anyways, having my opinions on each tradition within the original post may have ended up just getting in the way.

I agree with basically everything written here. The goal is to give ranged characters more traditions to play with, rather than more options in the one tradition they are all forced to take. More maneuvers that are mobility/battlefield control based and are actually useful would also help.

Thank you for putting this together!