An Examination of Differences between Editions

[Hussar]

My thought is that he's talking about commercial enterprises where the player has an enforceable contract with the MMORPG company, so it's of limited application here. If I as a player have a contractual relationship, I have legal rights.

Yes and no though. The EULA of any MMORPG pretty much always carries the caveat that they can change the game at any point in time without your consent. Rule 0 pretty much serves the same function. You cannot sue Blizzard if they nerf your character. Nor can you sue your DM for the same thing.

In a truly democratic game, then the players would have recourse available to them beyond simply walking out the door.

I'm honestly not sure if that would make a fun game though. IMO, probably not. It might work for some other systems, but, I think it would be a poor fit in D&D.

 

[S'mon]

Yes and no though. The EULA of any MMORPG pretty much always carries the caveat that they can change the game at any point in time without your consent.

In the UK and most countries, contracts on one party's written standard business terms are not necessarily enforceable vs the other party, especially where the other party is a consumer. A term as vague as "We can do what we like" will often be subject to a reasonableness test. I appreciate that US contract law is generally more pro-contract-writer and anti-consumer than in other nations.

 

[Lanefan]

No matter what veneers get laid over it, no matter what game or edition you're playing, if it has a DM it's essentially the DM's game that any player can choose to play or not play. End of story.

Most players soon enough realize this...those who don't aren't players for very long (though a rare few go on to become quite decent DMs themselves; I've seen this happen).

If I sign up for a 7th Sea game I'm expecting ships and pirates, cutlasses and cannons, pieces of eight and adventure on the high seas; and I somewhat expect the DM to provide these type of story elements, and the other players (and myself) to at least *try* to stay within theme. I don't expect to see robots, or hobbits, or lightsabers, and would be disappointed were any to show up other than as a short-lived DM-driven diversion.

Lanefan

 

[edgewaters]

The DMs foremost job is of a referee between NPCs/monsters and PCs - storytelling etc are secondary and indeed, not even possible without this first role. If he has no authority to make judgement calls and have the final say, then he cannot perform this role properly.

 

[Raven Crowking]

Honestly, I don't have a problem with the DM saying No. That's perfectly acceptable. However, what I've been trying to point out, and perhaps not doing a very good job, is that when the DM says No, he's placing his views of the campaign above that of the player's. Now, this might very well be a good thing. It might not.

Now, that I can agree with fully.

I don't accept the notion that limitations remove the ability to be creative, or that there is any more creativity involved in acting in a way that is unbounded by limitations. But the DM is saying that his views of the campaign are more important than the views of any single player, certainly, and to some degree more important than the views of the players as a whole.

From there, he gets to discover if he has players or not.

 

[As If]

Relatedly: Only describing people, places and/or things in detail when they are important is a big failing of mine. My players are like, "Huh, he spent 2 minutes describing the statue. let's check it out!"

You can train yourself to list the room's contents rather than describing them, when the PCs first enter a room.

There's a small painting on the south wall.
There's a stinky garbage pile in the northeast corner.
There's a bronze statue of a royal dude in the center of the room.

There will be time for detailed description in a minute, after Players have asked about the items they're interested in. But for starters it's pretty easy to get into a habit of listing ADJECTIVE NOUN POSITION, ADJECTIVE NOUN POSITION. Try it. Hope it helps.

 

[Hussar]

LOL, now HERE'S a blast from the past. Lots of names that are sadly missing now. Fun thread. Fun to see how my opinions have changed over the years too.

 

[Reynard]

LOL, now HERE'S a blast from the past. Lots of names that are sadly missing now. Fun thread. Fun to see how my opinions have changed over the years too.

No kidding. Wow.