Pathfinder 1E An open letter to Paizo

[billd91]

If this product winds up on their front page as a top seller or as part of a promotion, then I can't go there.

It also boils down to standards. I hold myself to a standard whereby I don't support companies that sell products that support drug use. It's not a standard I expect from other people...just me, to set an example for my kids.

How far do you take this? Do you let the kids listen to the radio? I can think of numerous rock and roll songs that are friendly to drug use (or sex or plenty of other less than stellar behavior).
Bookstores that have displays of Doonesbury books (a comic often criticized for promoting drug use)?

I'm wondering if you're holding yourself up to an impossible standard, and if that standard is really serving your kids effectively.

 

[Michael Dean]

Dogs in the Vineyard, Primetime Adventures, Mortal Coil. All are games that can be played without violence or with.

And plenty of others can be played with combat without glorifying killing other sentient beings.

I have to say I think you're stretching the argument a little thin to make your point. None of those games constitute a significant percentage of the overall rpg market, and certainly not Paizo's. The fact is, combat is a major component of D&D. I don't think that's a good or a bad thing, it just is. Whether it's slaying evil monsters or not, the game does focus on using violence to solve problems. I don't have a problem with that, but other people could reasonably take issue with that focus. While I applaud your efforts to using nonviolent aspects to roleplay (I certainly enjoy those types of games too), I do find it difficult to believe that many 13 year olds would not find the combat aspects of the game to be a primary reason for gaming.

And just to be a contrarian, I also don't take offense at the toy. It looks stupid, and not very creative, but I find it no more likely to foster drug use among young people than anything else in popular culture that kids are bombarded with every day.

As to the OP, I'm sorry you're in a tough job and that you have to see the effects of hard core drug use among young people. It must be very hard to deal with the suicide of someone you know, and I sympathize. I just disagree with you on this particular point that this toy encourages drug use. It's meant to be funny; how successful it is at that goal is not the point (I don't find it funny, not because of the subject matter but because it doesn't make me laugh). I don't think drug use is funny any more than I think that racism or sexism or spousal abuse is. But there have been some fine comediens over the years that have taken those same subjects and found some very funny things to say about them. I don't think that's a bad thing.

 

[Grimstaff]

This doll is definitely going to lead to an epidemic of drug use among small children and possibly even infants. One look at its dazed, smirking face is all it takes to make a small child say "Hey, mon, pass me dat gateway drug pleez!" Pity the poor babes asleep in their cribs, innocently clutching their "get and drugs and ruin your life" doll, mere steps away from prostitution and heroin addiction.

Why oh why Paizo!? Why!? How could you do this to the children!? THe Children!!

Ok, now can we go back to arguing BAB vs. THAC0?

 

[6pakofdwarves]

This doll is definitely going to lead to an epidemic of drug use among small children and possibly even infants. One look at its dazed, smirking face is all it takes to make a small child say "Hey, mon, pass me dat gateway drug pleez!" Pity the poor babes asleep in their cribs, innocently clutching their "get and drugs and ruin your life" doll, mere steps away from prostitution and heroin addiction.

Why oh why Paizo!? Why!? How could you do this to the children!? THe Children!!

Ok, now can we go back to arguing BAB vs. THAC0?

Dude, everyone knows THAC0 rules....
You never should have bought that doll, it obviously rotted your brain....

 

[billd91]

Also true. There have been several news articles recently about how today's children are "growing up" faster than previous generations.

I don't buy this for a second. If people are seriously talking about this, they aren't looking back far enough into history. Kids grew up mighty fast in the Great Depression or even before that during the industrial revolution. It's the fat years after WWII, where kids were allowed to remain kids longer than pretty much any time in history, that gives us this impression.

 

[Grimstaff]

Dude, everyone knows THAC0 rules....
You never should have bought that doll, it obviously rotted your brain....

Hmm, now that I think about it, I do remember my Mom buying me that "Harvee the Antisocial Gaming Geek" doll when I was a toddler. Why, Mom, Why!?!?

 

[AnonymousOne]

As a person who believes in legalization, I feel compelled to say this thread fails magnificently.

Thank you and have a nice day.

 

[johnnype]

Game shops sell plush dolls of evil gods that want to destroy the world (Cthulhu) but a plush of stoner is somehow unacceptable? That's a bit hypocritical no?

It's a stupid product and I can't understand why anyone would ever buy it but if the US constitution protects the the rights of people to publish magazines like High Times I think it only good and right that it protects those who want to sell it.

I think people are making a mountain out of a mole hill. Move on everyone. Nothing to see here.

 

[billd91]

Game shops sell plush dolls of evil gods that want to destroy the world (Cthulhu) but a plush of stoner is somehow unacceptable? That's a bit hypocritical no?

In defense of the OP, it's not hypocritical if your hot button is drug use but not fictitious elder beings from beyond space (or violence, looking at the other discussions going on in this thread).

 

[crazy_monkey1956]

How far do you take this? Do you let the kids listen to the radio? I can think of numerous rock and roll songs that are friendly to drug use (or sex or plenty of other less than stellar behavior).
Bookstores that have displays of Doonesbury books (a comic often criticized for promoting drug use)?

I'm wondering if you're holding yourself up to an impossible standard, and if that standard is really serving your kids effectively.

I'm a big fan of warning labels and voluntary rating systems. They are tools I, as a parent, can use to monitor what my children have access to, without the material itself being censored (I'm also vehemently against censorship).

That being said, I would be happy if Paizo slapped a warning label of some sort at the top of the page promoting this product. That does run contrary slightly to my initial post in this thread and, now that I think about it, my initial statement was a bit more absolute than the reality of my practices. I do listen to some music that contain drug-related lyrics and have watched movies containing portrayals of drug use...I just don't let my kids hear or see that stuff.