Menu
News
All News
Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
Pathfinder
Starfinder
Warhammer
2d20 System
Year Zero Engine
Industry News
Reviews
Dragon Reflections
Columns
Weekly Digests
Weekly News Digest
Freebies, Sales & Bundles
RPG Print News
RPG Crowdfunding News
Game Content
ENterplanetary DimENsions
Mythological Figures
Opinion
Worlds of Design
Peregrine's Next
RPG Evolution
Other Columns
From the Freelancing Frontline
Monster ENcyclopedia
WotC/TSR Alumni Look Back
4 Hours w/RSD (Ryan Dancey)
The Road to 3E (Jonathan Tweet)
Greenwood's Realms (Ed Greenwood)
Drawmij's TSR (Jim Ward)
Community
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Resources
Wiki
Pages
Latest activity
Media
New media
New comments
Search media
Downloads
Latest reviews
Search resources
EN Publishing
Store
EN5ider
Adventures in ZEITGEIST
Awfully Cheerful Engine
What's OLD is NEW
Judge Dredd & The Worlds Of 2000AD
War of the Burning Sky
Level Up: Advanced 5E
Events & Releases
Upcoming Events
Private Events
Featured Events
Socials!
Twitch
YouTube
Facebook (EN Publishing)
Facebook (EN World)
Twitter
Instagram
TikTok
Podcast
Features
Top 5 RPGs Compiled Charts 2004-Present
Adventure Game Industry Market Research Summary (RPGs) V1.0
Ryan Dancey: Acquiring TSR
Q&A With Gary Gygax
D&D Rules FAQs
TSR, WotC, & Paizo: A Comparative History
D&D Pronunciation Guide
Million Dollar TTRPG Kickstarters
Tabletop RPG Podcast Hall of Fame
Eric Noah's Unofficial D&D 3rd Edition News
D&D in the Mainstream
D&D & RPG History
About Morrus
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles only
By:
Forums & Topics
Forum List
Latest Posts
Forum list
*Dungeons & Dragons
Level Up: Advanced 5th Edition
D&D Older Editions
*TTRPGs General
*Pathfinder & Starfinder
EN Publishing
*Geek Talk & Media
Search forums
Chat/Discord
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
The
VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX
is LIVE! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!
Community
Archive Forums
Hosted Forums
Personal & Hosted Forums
Personal/Hosted Forums
The Society of 3.5 Revisionists
AoOs and the 5-foot step (Forked Thread: Nerf the spellcasters!)
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="Kerrick" data-source="post: 4606646" data-attributes="member: 4722"><p>Forked from: <a href="http://www.enworld.org/forum/showpost.php?postid=4604524" target="_blank"> Nerf the spellcasters! </a></p><p></p><p></p><p>I was thinking about this last night. I agree, to a point - given the choice between nerfing the mechanics and nerfing the PCs, you go for the mechanics first. </p><p></p><p>But, I don't see a way to do it in this case. I'm not totally sure, but I think the 5-foot step was introduced to give PCs a way to get SOME movement in while perfoming a full attack. The problem is that since it's effectively a free action that doesn't provoke AoOs, everyone abuses the hell out of it: Archer? Take a 5-foot step and unload a full attack just out of reach! Spellcaster? Take a 5-foot step and nuke that guy without an AoO! It's frustrating as hell to DMs and players alike, and it's <em>perfectly legal</em>.</p><p></p><p>There are a few possible solutions:</p><p></p><p>a) Get rid of the 5-foot step.</p><p></p><p>b) Rule that making a 5-foot step out of a threatened space provokes an AoO.</p><p></p><p>c) Give PCs who take a 5-foot step a penalty to their action.</p><p></p><p>d) Rule that PCs who take a 5-foot step to perform an action can do so, but still provoke an AoO (with a minus to hit because of the distance).</p><p></p><p>I'm sure you could think up a couple more, but that's what I've got. b) seems like the most viable to me; it follows the general rules for movement and prevents a huge amount of abuse. With the movement/attack rules we came up with, archers now have a viable method of moving and firing without having to rely on the 5-foot step, and anyone can still use the step to close with an enemy and make a full attack. As for spellcasters, I'd rule that if they take damage in the round before spellcasting, they have to make a Concentration check. They can then still make that 5-foot step, but they risk getting bashed and losing their focus.</p><p></p><p>Edit: Almost forgot... I was playing Oblivion last night; I rely heavily on archery - fire several arrows from distance before the enemies close, then draw the blade - but a few times I would just run backwards while firing. It's hard - really hard. The enemy's closing on you faster than you can retreat, smacking the crap out of you while you're trying to shoot arrows. I was effectively making a 5-foot step backwards and firing. Now, you might say that someone could move laterally and fire... but you'd run into the same problem, really - it's hard. I'd give ranged attacks a -2 penalty for a 5-foot step unless they have Shot on the Run OR unless you only make a single attack. Same thing for moving and attacking in general - it's hard to acquire a target while you're moving; that's why there's a feat for it. Say, -4 each for two attacks and -6 each for three. High Dex mitigates/negates this penalty, and Shot on the Run would eliminate it entirely.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Kerrick, post: 4606646, member: 4722"] Forked from: [url=http://www.enworld.org/forum/showpost.php?postid=4604524] Nerf the spellcasters! [/url] I was thinking about this last night. I agree, to a point - given the choice between nerfing the mechanics and nerfing the PCs, you go for the mechanics first. But, I don't see a way to do it in this case. I'm not totally sure, but I think the 5-foot step was introduced to give PCs a way to get SOME movement in while perfoming a full attack. The problem is that since it's effectively a free action that doesn't provoke AoOs, everyone abuses the hell out of it: Archer? Take a 5-foot step and unload a full attack just out of reach! Spellcaster? Take a 5-foot step and nuke that guy without an AoO! It's frustrating as hell to DMs and players alike, and it's [i]perfectly legal[/i]. There are a few possible solutions: a) Get rid of the 5-foot step. b) Rule that making a 5-foot step out of a threatened space provokes an AoO. c) Give PCs who take a 5-foot step a penalty to their action. d) Rule that PCs who take a 5-foot step to perform an action can do so, but still provoke an AoO (with a minus to hit because of the distance). I'm sure you could think up a couple more, but that's what I've got. b) seems like the most viable to me; it follows the general rules for movement and prevents a huge amount of abuse. With the movement/attack rules we came up with, archers now have a viable method of moving and firing without having to rely on the 5-foot step, and anyone can still use the step to close with an enemy and make a full attack. As for spellcasters, I'd rule that if they take damage in the round before spellcasting, they have to make a Concentration check. They can then still make that 5-foot step, but they risk getting bashed and losing their focus. Edit: Almost forgot... I was playing Oblivion last night; I rely heavily on archery - fire several arrows from distance before the enemies close, then draw the blade - but a few times I would just run backwards while firing. It's hard - really hard. The enemy's closing on you faster than you can retreat, smacking the crap out of you while you're trying to shoot arrows. I was effectively making a 5-foot step backwards and firing. Now, you might say that someone could move laterally and fire... but you'd run into the same problem, really - it's hard. I'd give ranged attacks a -2 penalty for a 5-foot step unless they have Shot on the Run OR unless you only make a single attack. Same thing for moving and attacking in general - it's hard to acquire a target while you're moving; that's why there's a feat for it. Say, -4 each for two attacks and -6 each for three. High Dex mitigates/negates this penalty, and Shot on the Run would eliminate it entirely. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Community
Archive Forums
Hosted Forums
Personal & Hosted Forums
Personal/Hosted Forums
The Society of 3.5 Revisionists
AoOs and the 5-foot step (Forked Thread: Nerf the spellcasters!)
Top