The Persian
First Post
I'd like to know if I can start play with a fighter geared towards the twirling links of steel and expect within reason to fare well.
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Are fighters that specialize in spiked chain viable/survivable at most/all levels?
- Thread starter The Persian
- Start date
Nonlethal Force
First Post
I'd say! The spiked chain is one of few weapons that is both a reach and regular melee weapon. it does 2d4 damage, a slight improvement over the standard 1d8 of your typical longsword. It allows you to make trip attacks and gives you a bonus to disarming opponents. And, you can weapon Finesse it if you are more of a dexterity build than a strength build. About the only thing a spiked chain doesn't suit well for is slinking quietly through a dungeon ... but then again it would make no more noise than your typical suit of armor might!
The Persian
First Post
Thank you both for your advice, I trust when i come up with my "build" for a level 2 character later I can expect some good critique and suggestions as well!
smootrk
First Post
I have a feeling that the spiked chain is 'broken'. I am sure that those who really like the weapon will disagree with my view, but I just don't see that it is better than the longsword, otherwise historically it would have been in wide use instead of polearms, swords, and axes.
Therefore, I think some judgment errors were made by the originators of the weapon stats.
Not to say that it couldn't be fixed with some adjustments like reduction in damage dice, penalties (as I see it, it takes space in all directions equal to its reach to spin around yourself to get the proper momentum for an attack or else face a penalty to both hit & damage), suseptible to countering disarming attacks, susceptable to sundering attacks... just to name a few drawbacks that might be appropriate to re-establish balance and reasoning why it was not in much greater use throughout history.
Therefore, I think some judgment errors were made by the originators of the weapon stats.
Not to say that it couldn't be fixed with some adjustments like reduction in damage dice, penalties (as I see it, it takes space in all directions equal to its reach to spin around yourself to get the proper momentum for an attack or else face a penalty to both hit & damage), suseptible to countering disarming attacks, susceptable to sundering attacks... just to name a few drawbacks that might be appropriate to re-establish balance and reasoning why it was not in much greater use throughout history.
Warehouse23
First Post
Jack Simth
First Post
That's one of the reasons a dedicated fighter always needs to carry a backup ranged weapon....
So smootrk, the disadvantages of it being a 2 handed weapon with low damage die, low crit range, low crit multiplier, and needing a feat to even use effectively arent enough?
Even when someone could simply use a normal reach weapon most of the time to gain all of the benefits and more (no feat required, higher damage, can hit things at range, etc).
I see people complaining a lot about the power of the spiked chain and it always strikes me as odd. In just about every way it is a poor excuse for a weapon, except you are able to attack in 5' and 10'. A benefit that can be gotten by a simple first level spell or potion or a few higher level spells or by having a reach weapon and being able to take a 5' step or who knows what else, there are tons of possibilities.
I have seen it used in my game once, but the player gave up because of his lack of damage with it (tried the finesse route, but between the various methods to ignore reach and its low damage die + low str he just couldnt do much with it) and have seen it used in other games once (this time it was my own character, high str, and a few nice feats.. it was fun, but once we got past the goblin stage of the game I really wanted my feats back and a different weapon).
It is a good weapon with interesting options, but to me it already seems to be on borderline underpowered for the cost.
If you assume that being able to attack both at 5' and 10' is worth a single feat (which seems pretty reasonable to me really, I believe there is a feat that allows one to use normal reach weapons in this way somewhere) then the weapon simply has a few nice benefits which counter its other drawbacks.
Also note that you can only get one aoo per round against a guy who moves through multiple threat spaces of yours.. they could run around you in circles and only provoke one.. so the comic above is a bit misleading
Even when someone could simply use a normal reach weapon most of the time to gain all of the benefits and more (no feat required, higher damage, can hit things at range, etc).
I see people complaining a lot about the power of the spiked chain and it always strikes me as odd. In just about every way it is a poor excuse for a weapon, except you are able to attack in 5' and 10'. A benefit that can be gotten by a simple first level spell or potion or a few higher level spells or by having a reach weapon and being able to take a 5' step or who knows what else, there are tons of possibilities.
I have seen it used in my game once, but the player gave up because of his lack of damage with it (tried the finesse route, but between the various methods to ignore reach and its low damage die + low str he just couldnt do much with it) and have seen it used in other games once (this time it was my own character, high str, and a few nice feats.. it was fun, but once we got past the goblin stage of the game I really wanted my feats back and a different weapon).
It is a good weapon with interesting options, but to me it already seems to be on borderline underpowered for the cost.
If you assume that being able to attack both at 5' and 10' is worth a single feat (which seems pretty reasonable to me really, I believe there is a feat that allows one to use normal reach weapons in this way somewhere) then the weapon simply has a few nice benefits which counter its other drawbacks.
Also note that you can only get one aoo per round against a guy who moves through multiple threat spaces of yours.. they could run around you in circles and only provoke one.. so the comic above is a bit misleading
