Armies of the Abyss??

[Desdichado]

What's the latest on this baby? Just a month or two ago it still had a January release date, the website now says February. Can we narrow that down any?

 

[Darkness]

Mmmmm - this will be a niiice book, judging from its predecessor.

 

[Desdichado]

That's certainly what I'm anticipating!

 

[Crothian]

Is legions of Hell really that good? No one I know has it and I've never picked it up to look at it. But people doi talk about it a lot on these boards.

 

[Ristamar]

Is legions of Hell really that good? No one I know has it and I've never picked it up to look at it. But people doi talk about it a lot on these boards.

Legions of Hell is, hands down, one of the best non-WotC d20 supplements available. I'd go as far as saying it's arguably THE BEST softcover non-WotC supplement on the market. Just check out the reviews right here on ENWorld.

I, too, am anxiously awaiting Armies of the Abyss. I sincerely hope it won't be the last in the series. Oh, one other thing... Pramas rules.

 

[Warchild]

Well.........

It is certaintly one of the better in terms campaign value and interesting npc's. I've used a couple myself. But it does suffer from some poor judgement on CR's and some of the Devil's abilities.
Frankly, i am getting sick to death of seeing these problems in D20 products. Although the blame certainly doesn't land just on Legions of Hell or Green Ronin in particular, i have decided that such things have become a major selling point to me from here on.
Mistakes or poor mechanics are no longer acceptable with a wink or a nod and a "hey, we'll get better, honest we will". Most D20 groups have been around a while now and i expect them to take a little more pride in their works.

Now, that being said, i am sure Armies of the Abyss will be very interesting and offer some great NPC's. Not necessarily just another slew of "red shirt" creatures that many "creature" books become, but real NPC's that can be used in my campaigns. However if they are still having trouble with mechanics, its staying on the shelf.

Hmmm......i'm in a bad mood now..............

 

[Psion]

Is legions of Hell really that good?

Yes. The creatures are generally well done and creative, and the book is riddled with plot ideas.

 

[Holden MaGroin]

I'll second that! (this seems to be my M.O - I show up after all comments that I would make have already been made).

Legions of Hell is great because it's not just another Monster Manual - it's also something like the WotC "enemies" book in that you're given Villains that you can build plots and adventures (and campaigns) around. Epic, epic stuff. Plus lots of cool things as well.

Can't wait for the next one.

- HM

 

[Desdichado]

It is certaintly one of the better in terms campaign value and interesting npc's. I've used a couple myself. But it does suffer from some poor judgement on CR's and some of the Devil's abilities.
Frankly, i am getting sick to death of seeing these problems in D20 products. Although the blame certainly doesn't land just on Legions of Hell or Green Ronin in particular, i have decided that such things have become a major selling point to me from here on.
Mistakes or poor mechanics are no longer acceptable with a wink or a nod and a "hey, we'll get better, honest we will". Most D20 groups have been around a while now and i expect them to take a little more pride in their works.

Are you saying WotC is any better at CRs? Are you saying that the CR system as a whole works well? I'm just trying to gauge your opinion here, because I don't believe either of those questions to have the answer yes. In that regard, LoH is as good rulewise as any other product, WOTC or not. This percieved dichotomy between d20 products and WOTC products is non-existent, especially in the case of outfits like Green Ronin where WOTC employees are writing the books and running the show! I've even heard these kinds of complaints about Malhovic Press, which is absurd, since Monte co-wrote the damn rules in the first place.

Now, that being said, i am sure Armies of the Abyss will be very interesting and offer some great NPC's. Not necessarily just another slew of "red shirt" creatures that many "creature" books become, but real NPC's that can be used in my campaigns. However if they are still having trouble with mechanics, its staying on the shelf.

I'd really like to know what mechanical problems you are having that could possibly make what was one of the best supplements to the game yet released stay on the shelf. CRs? I'm not following here...

 

[trimeulose]

The best part about LoH is that it offers some real time enemies. There are actual personalities written in to their descriptions, and most have histories to explain why and how. Definately one of the best supplements. Also if PCs plan on running an evil PC, there are some interesting ideas on how to carry on a PC after death. Heck even paladins could roam around hell if the were freed from an obliete.

I'm hoping that another supplement would be added to the list. Throngs of the heavens, not to be confused with thongs from heaven.

if I can get a hold of it before the next time I DM, I'll probably have my players make some decent level PCs and have them run an Abyss vs Hell kind of campaign.