Attacks of Opportunity and Trip and Fun

[Kahlenar]

I really have to get something clear here. I read over some of the threads about Attacks of Opportunity (AOOs) and it seems that generally people allow people to make trip attacks as attacks of opportunity. If I could get a quick thought on that while I move to more difficult matters.

So, Improved Trip allows for 3 things. Don't provoke attacks, +4 on trip checks, and it allows you to make an attack at the BAB you just used to trip your target (then you can continue with your other attacks at lower BABs including making more trips).

My question is if you have Imp Trip and trip someone as an AOO, do you then get to make an attack against them as part of the attack of opportunity. Basically, since Imp Trip gives you the successful trip attack back it seems like you could, except the AOOs would then seems a bit broken.

Just as a side note, if all this is possible, then, since standing up provokes an AOO, wouldn't it be possible to keep someone eternally tripped AND get an extra attack each round against them, all at the attacking prone bonus? I would love this, but it seems a bit overpowering, especially with combat reflexes, you could immobilize multiple opponents while hitting all of them.

Just wondering, thanks for any feedback.

 

[Mouseferatu]

My question is if you have Imp Trip and trip someone as an AOO, do you then get to make an attack against them as part of the attack of opportunity. Basically, since Imp Trip gives you the successful trip attack back it seems like you could, except the AOOs would then seems a bit broken.

Yes, you can. Part of the Improved Trip is the extra attack.

Just as a side note, if all this is possible, then, since standing up provokes an AOO, wouldn't it be possible to keep someone eternally tripped AND get an extra attack each round against them, all at the attacking prone bonus? I would love this, but it seems a bit overpowering, especially with combat reflexes, you could immobilize multiple opponents while hitting all of them.

No. This has been clarified by the FAQ. The AoO comes immediately before the action that triggered it. Thus, when someone draws an AoO from trying to stand, the attack technically comes before they stand up. You cannot trip someone who is already prone. So no, once someone is down, you cannot keep tripping them as the AoO.

 

[Hypersmurf]

I really have to get something clear here. I read over some of the threads about Attacks of Opportunity (AOOs) and it seems that generally people allow people to make trip attacks as attacks of opportunity. If I could get a quick thought on that while I move to more difficult matters.

Check Table 8-2 in the PHB. Trip carries footnote 7, which explicitly allows it to be used as an AoO.

My question is if you have Imp Trip and trip someone as an AOO, do you then get to make an attack against them as part of the attack of opportunity.

Yes. That's what the feat does.

Just as a side note, if all this is possible, then, since standing up provokes an AOO, wouldn't it be possible to keep someone eternally tripped AND get an extra attack each round against them, all at the attacking prone bonus? I would love this, but it seems a bit overpowering, especially with combat reflexes, you could immobilize multiple opponents while hitting all of them.

If they're receiving the -4 AC penalty for being Prone, then they're still on the ground, and you can't Trip them. When they provoke by attempting to stand, you'll get an AoO, but it won't be a Trip.

-Hyp.

 

[Hypersmurf]

The AoO comes immediately before the action that triggered it.

Which is why an AoO can't disrupt someone casting a spell, since it occurs before their Cast a Spell action.

... no, wait. Something like that.

-Hyp.

 

[Mouseferatu]

Which is why an AoO can't disrupt someone casting a spell, since it occurs before their Cast a Spell action.

... no, wait. Something like that.

-Hyp.

Hey, I'm just quoting the rules here. Ya want consistency, go somewhere else.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Hey, I'm just quoting the rules here.

Well, what the rules say is that an AoO interrupts the flow of actions.

Which to me argues that it doesn't 'come before' the provoking action; it merely resolves before the provoking action.

The provoking action must have already started when the AoO is resolved, because otherwise a/ the provocation hasn't actually happened!, and b/ spells would not be disrupted.

It's readied actions that explicitly occur before the triggering action in the rules, not AoOs.

-Hyp.

 

[Thanee]

However it is, precisely, I would not allow an AoO against a prone target standing up to trip it down again, thus keeping it on the ground. I would count the -4 prone AC modifier, though. Trip is good enough already.

Bye
Thanee

 

[Mouseferatu]

Well, what the rules say is that an AoO interrupts the flow of actions.

Which to me argues that it doesn't 'come before' the provoking action; it merely resolves before the provoking action.

The provoking action must have already started when the AoO is resolved, because otherwise a/ the provocation hasn't actually happened!, and b/ spells would not be disrupted.

It's readied actions that explicitly occur before the triggering action in the rules, not AoOs.

All right, yes. It "resolves" before the triggering action, not necessarily "comes before" it. Lack of clarity on my part. But in a purely mechanical sense, at least, they amount to the same thing.

 

[bestone]

interrupts? oh no mtg mtg! invaaaadessssss

 

[Hypersmurf]

But in a purely mechanical sense, at least, they amount to the same thing.

Well, it depends.

If someone's already started standing from prone, are they still prone?

-Hyp.