D&D 5E Best Class and Specialization for Infiltration?

[Garresh]

Hey, just looking for some advice on the best class for infiltration work around level 9 in an urban environment. I played as an Arcane Trickster but had to retire him for purely roleplay reasons. But, I was kind of dissatisfied with my ability to deal with magical defenses on areas, especially since your spells list is limited to only 1 spell outside of Illusion and Enchantment.

Here's a number of situations I've run into:

Alarm Spells. They're cast on doors, windows, and rooms. I've triggered these several times, unfortunately.

Antimagic Fields. Example: I was walking through an open gate with an invisibility spell, sneaking past 2 low level guards. Unfortunately there was an antimagic field in place, so I was quickly grappled and thrown in a cell. Luckily another stealthy character in our group misty stepped through the fence and managed to get me out, because he was really lucky the alarm spell in place had just worn off.

Magical Traps. There's no way to find traps without using Detect Magic or Identify, and again I have to choose between knowing they're there, or knowing what I'm dealing with, significantly limiting my options. Sometimes I'll make an educated guess and choose horribly wrong. Like if I decide maybe we should trigger a distraction and run through, only to discover it's a sleep spell not an alarm.

So when facing these scenarios, an arcane trickster really does just fall flat. They're good in combat, but I actually feel like rogues as a whole kind of suck for scouting against anything that isn't mundane. If they're scouting using invisibility, they can't see traps. If they're sneaking with detect magic, they can't tell what kind of trap it is or anything. If they take identify, they can't see traps anymore.

So for a level 9 infiltrator and scout, how do I get a way to deal with these things without gimping myself?

 

[CapnZapp]

I think your DMs campaign is significantly more magical than mine if you already at level 9 have encountered many magical traps and several areas of antimagic.

You're right: a Rogue isn't built for that environment.

Compare to official modules. I haven't read through them all, but I wouldn't be surprised if you could play all the way up to level 9 and encounter no none zilch magical defenses whatsoever.

Given what I know of your DMs preferences, I would simply drop the idea of scouting ahead.

Now, I could suggest things like having an invisible flying scout (chainlock imp) or using magic spells to scout and scry. But I won't.

Why? Because I'm getting the feeling your DM fills his encounters will all that magic because he dislikes infiltrators and wants to deter scouting ahead.

It's perfectly possible to have a DM who envisions parties that heroically take whatever the bad guys throws against them, but does so collectively.

So the real solution is: talk to your DM. No use giving infiltration advice if the DM doesn't like having to reveal his goodies to one player before the rest.

Before you do, come up with an alternative build. Like a kick-in-the-door style Barbarian or something.

You should quickly suss out if the DM becomes all enthusiastic about that other build, and then you will have your answer.

It could also be that what you consider to be an exciting and selfless scouting run, is what the others consider stealing the spotlight. You might end up having to choose between finding another group or accepting that the traps need to happen to the other party members too.

 

[Garresh]

I think your DMs campaign is significantly more magical than mine if you already at level 9 have encountered many magical traps and several areas of antimagic.

You're right: a Rogue isn't built for that environment.

Compare to official modules. I haven't read through them all, but I wouldn't be surprised if you could play all the way up to level 9 and encounter no none zilch magical defenses whatsoever.

Given what I know of your DMs preferences, I would simply drop the idea of scouting ahead.

Now, I could suggest things like having an invisible flying scout (chainlock imp) or using magic spells to scout and scry. But I won't.

Why? Because I'm getting the feeling your DM fills his encounters will all that magic because he dislikes infiltrators and wants to deter scouting ahead.

It's perfectly possible to have a DM who envisions parties that heroically take whatever the bad guys throws against them, but does so collectively.

So the real solution is: talk to your DM. No use giving infiltration advice if the DM doesn't like having to reveal his goodies to one player before the rest.

Before you do, come up with an alternative build. Like a kick-in-the-door style Barbarian or something.

You should quickly suss out if the DM becomes all enthusiastic about that other build, and then you will have your answer.

It could also be that what you consider to be an exciting and selfless scouting run, is what the others consider stealing the spotlight. You might end up having to choose between finding another group or accepting that the traps need to happen to the other party members too.

Actually, she prefers that we not go murder-hobo about it. The one time our barbarian charged ahead and started a fight and we had to fight together, we wound up killing a couple dozen people, along with some innocent guards and bystanders. We're encouraged to use subterfuge if we can, but we're facing some pretty steep stuff sometimes...like 8th level antimagic spells sitting on gates without any warning.

But anyways, not everyone in the party is suited to this, and we've had mixed results with regards to stealth when that really should be the ideal approach for minimizing casualties. Also, in most of these stealth runs I wasn't operating solo. Usually I'd have backup nearby, or second operative with stealth inside of message range. Basically on a successful mission I might check ahead so far, and message back where the guards are, following by us using the nearest opening and our druid casting Pass Without Trace to get the party where they need to be.

So whatever the mechanics are doing, her intention is to have a fair number of our missions involve stealth, so I'm trying to find a way do that without completely falling flat. We have the magical coverage of pass without trace, but scouting these compounds is hard. If anything, I was told that I should've just used a level 1 detect magic before going on, but I can only concentrate on 1 spell at a time, so...

Plus, you can't even use stealth if you don't have cover, so I pretty much have to either use invisibility or something else along those lines.

 

[The Grassy Gnoll]

Warlock with Devils Sight and Mask of Many Faces with Misty Escape to poof through keyholes etc, multi classed with a Shadow Monk.

 

[Sunseeker]

You might get more use out of a Rogue/Wizard MC I know it's similar to an Arcane Trickster, but apparently you will get full Wizard levels along with some of the Rogue bonuses to being sneaky. Just how you want to split is up to you, but I'd probably suggest Rogue 6/Wziard---everything else. Might ask your DM if you could just retool your "retired" character, since it's thematically almost identical.

Personally, if stealth wasn't an option and murderhoboing wasn't an option....I'd wonder exactly what the DM expects you to do to resolve situations. Diplomacy?

 

[Garresh]

You might get more use out of a Rogue/Wizard MC I know it's similar to an Arcane Trickster, but apparently you will get full Wizard levels along with some of the Rogue bonuses to being sneaky. Just how you want to split is up to you, but I'd probably suggest Rogue 6/Wziard---everything else. Might ask your DM if you could just retool your "retired" character, since it's thematically almost identical.

Personally, if stealth wasn't an option and murderhoboing wasn't an option....I'd wonder exactly what the DM expects you to do to resolve situations. Diplomacy?

Varies from mission to mission. Sometimes it's murderhobo-able, and other times it requires what passes for a subtle approach.

At this point, I'm thinking a hybrid of Warlock and Shadow Monk is the way to go, since it has a ton of stealth utility and decent combat ability. Toss in a familiar and there's even more utility. Either way, I'd need to pick up invisibility.

The fact that stealth can only be used when you're already concealed from the enemy makes it a fairly weak skill imho, so magical augmentation is basically required. I can't tell you how many times I've been unable to even roll stealth because I had my invis cancelled by antimagic, or just other situations came up. Or I'm on a roof preparing and ambush but because the roof is flat with no edge I can't stealth there if I can see them. Bleh.

I love 5e, but I do kind of think the rules on stealth are a weak point for it.

Edit: This is more for down the road. I'm using a character that I might actually stick with for a long time, and who is pretty unlikely to die. He's a Cleric 1/Wild Sorc 8 Hill Dwarf with 18 in Con, and 16 in his casting stats(both of them), along with an ample supply of Shield castings, twinned/quickened healing, and buff spells. Add in that he uses a shield and full plate and this guy probably won't be dying anytime soon. I think I only gave him 1 damage spell, but he can spam hastes, greater invisibility, and combat healing if needed. I believe he actually has more hit points than our barbarian.

 

[Cap'n Kobold]

Firstly, the requirement to use Detect Magic to find magical traps is a house rule. Any character can attempt to discover/disarm a magical trap with Intelligence(Arcana).

How about a Land Druid? The right terrain will give you access to invisibility, and the ability to take an unassuming form and just fly over many of the defences might be better than sneaking in invisible. You have access to Detect Magic and Dispel magic for magical traps, and Backgrounds can give you other necessary skills and Thieves' tools. Speak with Animals is a pretty good scouting and infiltration spell combined with that.

Or go with a more mundane route. Assassin or Thief Rogue are able to talk and/or sneak their way in, using disguise kits etc. Appear to be the right person, and the guards themselves will take you past the traps.

Lastly, if its a party thing, not necessarily you personally wanting to be a master infiltrator, might I suggest an Artificer Wizard as an enabler? Your ability to create potions of flying and invisibility amongst others would help another member of the party be an infiltrator, even better if they are a spellcaster who can use your scrolls as well.

 

[Ahglock]

Lore bard. Full boat of magic skills, stupid good at skills, cutting words to help on opposed checks. You should be able to talk or sneak past anything.

Also stealth as written isn't as restrictive as you make out outside of combat. In combat everyone is magically looking everywhere and don't have a single second where they are distracted. Which while stupid IMO still allows you to sneak out of combat a bit more liberally. It's a GM ruling not the rules if out of combat they are super restrictive. Not a house rule as it's not explicit either way.

 

[Dausuul]

Are you allowed feats? If so, Skulker is what you're looking for. It allows you to hide when lightly obscured, and can't be shut down by antimagic. At 9th level, a rogue can get Stealth up to +13 (+4 proficiency, +4 Expertise, +5 Dex), which is near-invisibility against most opponents.

For magical traps, you should be able to locate them with an Arcana check - just make sure you have it proficient, have a decent Int (14 or so), and maybe put Expertise into that as well.

Consider a variant human assassin (again, if feats are allowed) with the bonus feat in Skulker. At 10th level, you'll get another ASI, which you could convert to a second feat; Ritual Caster is good if you want access to detect magic, Actor if you have a good Charisma and want to make the most of your disguise options.

 

[Garresh]

Wait with finding magical traps with arcana does that apply to stuff like alarm spells on doors or what? My old trickster had a fantastic arcana score but I never got to apply it for that... Was told I needed detect magic or bust.