Best Heroes game to start

[SWBaxter]

My group is thinking about changing campaigns and playing superhero game, but most of us have little or no experience with recent ones.

I believe right now, the big three on the market are Hero (with the Champions line), Mutants and Masterminds, and Silver Age Sentinels (available in d20 and Tri-Stat flavours). There's others on the market, but I think those are the three that dominate the general superhero arena, other games are either niche products or bit players (often both). And actually I'm not sure about SAS, apparently their release schedule has slowed to a crawl.

Hero is the oldest of the three, and IMHO the best engineered ruleset. Gamers have been pounding on its point system for so long that the exceptions and holes are either cleaned up or well enough known that the rulebook tells you what to do about them. The downside is that the system can seem dauntingly complex to a newcomer, though the great majority of the complexity is in character creation, during play most of it fades into the background. It's still pretty intimidating to pick up FRED (the big black and green rulebook) with the intention of making your first (or even 10th) character.

M&M is the youngest of the three, very well-received. It's got a good basic system, not too unlike Hero's but generally simpler and quicker. IMHO first edition suffered somewhat from fencepost conditions - a small string of very good or very bad rolls could turn the fortunes of a fight completely around - but lots of people apparently had no such problems. I haven't picked up second edition yet to see if that's been fixed; there were also some obvious point balance problems in 1E, most of which look like they have been fixed.

Silver Age Sentinels uses the Tri-Stat dX system (which is available free from their website, if you're interested: http://www.guardiansorder.com/downloads/ ), which is a pretty nice balance between fast play and system detail. I'd put it somewhere between M&M and Hero on those scales. The bad news is (IMHO) the system has more balance wonkiness than either of the others, a fixable problem if the GM keeps a firm reign on character creation.

And this includes things like how many supplements are available, or how many supplements are 'required' to play. How easy is it to play with only a couple of copies of the book(s), or will we each need a copy,etc.

Hero has the most supplements available, I believe. SAS and M&M are tied for a distant second (though with M&M, most of the supplements are currently 1E). How many books you need for each depends mostly on GM familiarity with the system, and willingness to work. How many copies depend on how you do character creation, all three systems have fairly detailed character design so ideally a player who's designing their own character will have sole access to a rulebook for a few hours. IMHO:

Hero - GM needs FRED, and the UNTIL Superpowers Database is pretty close to a must-have. Lots of other supplements are nice-to-have - I don't think any of the Hero supplements are clunkers - but they're all a matter of GM taste. Players can get by fine with a copy of Sidekick, which is a relatively cheap, stripped-down version of the rulebook that lacks many examples and a few powers. Goes for 10 bucks as I recall. Rulebooks are setting-free, if you want a campaign setting the books to look for are Champions Universe (which is the overview book) and whichever of the various city books strike your fancy. Millenium City is a modern superhero city, Hudson City is a dark Gotham-like place overrun with crime, Vibora Bay is a mystical Gulf city, all are darn good.

M&M - GM needs the rulebook. Probably about one copy for every 2-3 players would be a good ratio at the table. It's another settingless book, Freedom City is one of the best setting books published for any superhero RPG (and worth a look even if you choose another system so long as you have a place for a Metropolis/Marvel New York-style city in your campaign, there isn't much crunch and it's a really excellent book). Other supplements are all 1E, and might not be much use to you without some conversion work, as I understand it many will be re-released in 2E over the next year.

SAS - GM needs the rulebook, I'd suggest copies of the Tri-Stat dX .pdf for the players to start. I believe SAS includes a setting with the rulebook - leaning heavily towards the silver age, of course - other supplements are nice-to-haves rather than need-to-haves.

For me personally, after trying out M&M 1E for a bit I found myself going back to Hero. I just found it suited my style better, YMWV. I haven't ever run SAS (or Tri-stat) in a full session, so I can't really compare how it plays to the other two.

 

[Dragonblade]

If you want to try a new system I recommend Heroe's Unlimited from Palladium Books which I was heavy into a couple years ago. It allows you to create any type of Super hero you can think of along with it also has a Villian's sourcebook just in case you would also like to go that route also.

I hate to be negative, but I would avoid Heroes Unlimited. I used to own every Palladium Book under the sun. Including Heroes Unlimited. The game is simple and all super powers are pre-built. Meaning you just pick from a list. You also don't have the ability to customize powers at all. For experienced gamers, or for comic book fans, you'll be frustrated by the inability to accurately model many comic book characters. You'll find yourself creating characters around the rules, instead of using the rules to create exactly the character you envision.

If you like rules heavy and complexity, HERO is a good choice. It's sourcebooks are awesome and packed full of useful material. The game also allows you to come up with exactly the character you envision. However, its tool kit approach and number crunching leaves a lot of players cold. Be prepared for long character gen and a lot of prep before running adventures. Combat is also extremely tactical and can take a long time. It is a good solid system, and you can easily use the same rules to play in virtually any setting or genre, from super to fantasy to modern and so on.

If you want something you can easily bolt on top of d20 Modern, there is 4 Color to Fantasy and Blood and Vigilance. Don't know much about them, so I'll leave it at that.

But in my opinion, the best choice is hands down Mutants and Masterminds 2nd Edition. Its simple, it basically d20 with some changes here and there. If you know d20, you'll pretty much already know how to play. It offers the versatility of HERO, but with much less complexity and prep time. Its extremely easy to create almost any comic character you can think of. And combat runs faster than any RPG I have ever played. A little too fast sometimes, but its nothing a house rule or two can't fix.

 

[Eosin the Red]

You can just re-read SWBaxters post for my opinion.

Hero = strongest system - more intimidation.
M&M = FAR prettier + d20ish rules + simpler - cost - already gone to version 2E

There are a dozen or so other games out now Living Legends (V&V 2E), Truth & Justice, SAS, FC2F, and a couple others but your strong contenders are Hero and M&M. The books are less expensive and less numerous for M&M but they are also one third of the size of Hero books so the relative cost benifit is dubious at best.

In any system, I would recommend Arron Allistons Champions book (fifth entry from the top). It covers the genre and is useful just about any single supers game. Plus it is Arron.

 

[Michael Tree]

I have to agree with the M&M 2e horde, though I'd also recommend the old Marvel Superheroes FASERIP game, if you want something quick and simple.

M&M has the best balance of character creation detail and ease of use of all the superhero RPGs I know (or other type of RPG, for that matter). It can be used to create virtually any hero type, yet is relatively simple and intuitive. Best of all, it's quick and exciting in play, and actually feels like a comic book.

The M&M 2e rulebook is complete, and there are pdf supplements already already for sale, and official book supplements are due out soon. Freedom City is one of the best RPG setting supplements I've ever read, and the 2nd edition will be brimming with even more information and characters than the 1st edition.

Hero is very detailed and internally consistent, but is too needlessly complex and far too slow in play for my liking. Some complain about the amount of math needed to create a character, but its the slow gameplay and abundance of bookeeping that makes it undesireable to me.

The old Marvel Superheroes FASERIP system is still one of my favorites, even though its been out of print for almost 15 years. Its my game of choice for quick pickup games, since its dead simple and quick. However, it isn't as detailed as the others, it has a number of odd and clumsy rules, and it doesn't provide much character progression as a game advances, which some players dislike.

 

[Khairn]

The most enjoyable game of Supers' I've played used HERO. M&M is great game and I had a lot of fun playing it, but it never really clicked for me and my group.

Many find HERO to be too crunchy, but I really like how it balances powers & fun.

 

[Drowbane]

I was fond of Champions 3rd Ed back in the day. I never became very familiar with the rules, but that was fine as our GM knew them inside and out...

I haven't really looked at HERO 5th. Unfortunately for them Mutants and Masterminds came out first.

 

[Kichwas]

This is another M&M recommendation, but an enthusiastic one. I love 1st edition, but I’m not completely sold on 2nd edition. Just be aware that the two are pretty different.

I'm in the same boat.

2e seems good, but it is the amount of changes seen between ADnD to DnD 3e, to get the amount of results seen between DnD 3.0 and DnD 3.5.

The internal logic of 1e is gone, replaced by a case by case sort of rules system. That might be good if the internal logic of 1e led to bad results, or it might be troubling if it now makes the game more complicated to handle.

But, that said, some version of MnM is better than most any other choice.


Hero 5e came out in 2001, MnM 1e came out in 2003.

 

[Dwarven Godfather]

This is to Dragonblade,

I have also had all the Palladium books, but did you look into the 2nd Edition of Heroe's Unlimited where you could actually combine superpowers to get different aspects of the powers as well. 2nd Ed. also actually had a City developed along with other sourcebooks as well and is alot more received then 1st. ed. ever was. They also developed a maximum security Island for the supers for this city as well and was a very hard set of books for me to part with when I traded my whole collection of 32+ books for D20/OGL books.

I highly recommend the 2nd Edition stuff over 1st edition of Heroe's Unlimited and is one of the biggest sellers especially when it comes to the Palladium series.

 

[EditorBFG]

I have found that Mutants & Masterminds is the quickest and most versatile in terms of hero creation, and the easiest for new players to learn. It's the best superhero game in print to me, except for Godlike (which isn't exactly a regular superhero game). As far as older systems, I like DC Heroes (although WEG's recent DC Universe RPG was fun and easy too).

 

[danzig138]

I recommend the Advanced Marvel Super Heroes RPG if you can find a cheap copy, and a copy of the Ultimate Powers Books for said game. Heck, I think you can probably find a free copy online.
Also, Aberrant d20 is all right. It is basically d20 Modern with supers stuff, and an interesting setting.
Stay away from Heroes Unlimited, both the 1st and 2nd editions.
I can't recommend Mutants and Masterminds because I don't have it, and besides, I get tired of the pimping of it.