Best system for Dungeon Crawling

[Ednoc]

Hello boys and girls. And others. And Goblinoids.

There is a LOT of topics about this. And I mean... A LOT. But some are pretty old, 5E wasn't even a thing.

So, I'll try to be straightforward for one time in my life.

I have some friends who like wargames, playing with maps and miniatures, who, I think, need to have something in their hands and are not completely satisfied with all the roleplaying thing like talking about your action and only using imagination.

I don't really like Tabletop Board Games because they're laking of options and PC progression.

So, I'm looking for a system to emulate what I'm looking for : A good dungeon Crawler.

I liked the Dungeon & Dragons fantasy boardgame but... It's far so limited. No real progression, only 3 levels, few weapons...

At the moment, my choices could be :

- Pathfinder : Because you can do almost everything you want.
- D&D 5/4/3.5 ? Dunno what could fit best and there's a lot of arguments about which version should be better for that kind of game. Some people talk about older versions too like the first one or advanced D&D.
- Dungeon Crawl Classic RPG
- Barebones Fantasy

And many more.

I'd like to have something my players would like. I don't want to put too much preparation for each session since it has to be a dungeon crawler : Almost no plot. Just fight, treasure and monsters.
But I would like to have my players want to play again and I like to see players gains in power through sessions.

Some modules are good for DC, but are made for one shots or very short sessions, and I'd prefer to have something consistent.

So.
- What do you think about it ?
- If you had to take a system for a dungeon crawler, what would you pick ?
- If you are already mastering or playing a dungeon crawler type of game, what do you use ?

I'm a bit lost since I mainly played D&D5 a lot and some other, but not much and there is PLENTY of system...

Thanks by advance.

 

[lycanthropejeff]

I think 5e would be good as the 'tactical rules' make for interesting tabletop battles. If you can get them into the RP aspect later on down the line then you can have a good time with that, too. Character prep might take a little while but you could skip the background stuff and just focus on the tactical features and skills. Get yourself some 1 inch grid paper or a grid mat and some minis or other counters and have at it!

You probably have enough stuff to get you started with the 5e SRD (https://www.5esrd.com/) and don't have to spend a dime unless your players want more depth to their characters or want more spells...

jtk

 

[Mercule]

Depending on exactly what you're looking for, I'd be tempted to go with D&D 4E. It's actually not a bad game, over all. My group moved away from it for two reasons: 1) It didn't feel like "D&D", to us. There were just too many changes to things, like the U/E/D power structure. 2) It felt much more focused on precise mechanical and combat bits than the roleplay aspect of an RPG. The rules focused on clear, mechanically consistent application even when it didn't make sense from a "realistic" perspective -- I believe it was the fire orb (regardless of actual name) cantrip that had to target a creature, specifically, so the wizard couldn't use it to burn down a door (by RAW) even given all the time in the world.

Going into system selection with informed expectations, the first point is something of a non-issue. For a dungeon crawl that is (presumably) expected to be pretty combat-centric, the second point is probably a boon more than bane.

 

[Blue]

X-crawl was a system all about dungeon crawls - but with the added layer that they were effectively "televised" (the wizard did it) and used as Bread and Circuses to keep the common people entertained. Which means there was a whole system of patronage, ratings and the like.

D&D 3.5ed would be out for me because of how much prep the DM needs to do in order to build interesting foes according to the rules. Pathfinder has the same issues, though the Pathfinder 2 beta testing comes out for free in August and that's one of the things they addressed.

D&D 4e has a great tactical combat, and your proposed usage can really showcase the system's strengths while not engaging some of it's weaknesses. The one issue is that once you get to paragon each player has so many distinct choices to evaluate it can slow down the game - we were getting into interesting but not boss-level fighters and they could take a session and a half to resolve. (Playing 3.5 hours in an evening.) On the other hand, that's highly player dependent, and might not be an issue at your table. Also they came out with new classes in their Essentials products that kept complexity more manageable across the higher levels if you have just one or two players who might take a long time every turn, steer them that way. On the other hand, low levels plays fast and furious.

One other point about 4e - it does assume that you'll have at least one character of each role they define - Defender, Striker, Leader and Controller. It's not a hard and fast rule, but the game makes some synergy assumptions about balance.

13th Age and 5e will both do workmanship jobs, and go faster allowing you to explore more (and get in more combats) in the same amount of time. But they default to less tactical options and won't be as crunchy. It sounds like that may not be exactly what your group is looking for.

 

[Doug McCrae]

TT rpgs:
4e would be the best choice, followed by Pathfinder and 5e.

Boardgames:
Gloomhaven is a solid contender. It sounds about as close as a boardgame can get to being D&D.

And also:
Best dungeon crawl with some leveling up

 

[Blue]

Oh, while I recommended 4e, I played it with the subscription which means I had access to the Compendium for both quick in-game rules look-ups as well as character building, and I had access to the character builders, originally the (superior) offline one and then the online one. 4e, like 3.x, had a LOT of books, so having something to bring all the options together was useful. The other part is that they did EXTENSIVE errata to the point to reworking and balance changes, not just fixing typos. It included rewriting whole sections (mounted combat, etc.), so having a rules source like the Compendium that both collected the rules and had the latest errata integrated made it a lot easier.

Those tools aren't offered anymore by WotC, I don't know if there are licensed replacements out there.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Once upon a time, before there was GURPS, before there was Steve Jackson Games, there was a company called Metagamig which (among other fine products) released fantasy combat themed game called Melee. Its success led to a similar game called Wizard. Eventually the two were merged & mutated into The Fantasy Trip: In the Labyrinth- one of the simplest RPGs ever invented. ChaGen took 5 minutes- 10 if you were very indecisive. Leveling up wasn’t much of a thing- skills improved; casters gained a spell here and there.

Perfect for beer & pretzels level gaming.

It is long out of print, but Dark City Games has essentially resurrected the system.

http://www.darkcitygames.com

 

[GMMichael]

At the moment, my choices could be :

- Pathfinder : Because you can do almost everything you want.
- D&D 5/4/3.5 ? Dunno what could fit best and there's a lot of arguments about which version should be better for that kind of game. Some people talk about older versions too like the first one or advanced D&D.
- Dungeon Crawl Classic RPG
- Barebones Fantasy

...

I'd like to have something my players would like. I don't want to put too much preparation for each session since it has to be a dungeon crawler : Almost no plot. Just fight, treasure and monsters.
But I would like to have my players want to play again and I like to see players gains in power through sessions.

...

- What do you think about it ?
- If you had to take a system for a dungeon crawler, what would you pick ?
- If you are already mastering or playing a dungeon crawler type of game, what do you use ?

Don't go Pathfinder - they're about to upgrade to something that will be much cooler.

DCC: I haven't played it, but as a "streamlined OGL" game, I'd expect it to make for smoother dungeon crawling than D&D 3. And maybe 5.

If you're trying to avoid prep, go with Modos 2. It has only one table to reference, and a GM Toolbox to make your job super easy. Free, and the link is in my signature

 

[Blue]

Once upon a time, before there was GURPS, before there was Steve Jackson Games, there was a company called Metagamig which (among other fine products) released fantasy combat themed game called Melee. Its success led to a similar game called Wizard. Eventually the two were merged & mutated into The Fantasy Trip: In the Labyrinth- one of the simplest RPGs ever invented. ChaGen took 5 minutes- 10 if you were very indecisive. Leveling up wasn’t much of a thing- skills improved; casters gained a spell here and there.

Perfect for beer & pretzels level gaming.

It is long out of print, but Dark City Games has essentially resurrected the system.

http://www.darkcitygames.com

Wait, wait, wait, wait, WAIT.

The Fantasy Trip is descended from Melee and Wizard? Are we talking the same thing, the little pocket games were you fought in an arena and leveled up slowly when you didn't die? Wizards used their health (whatever it was called) to cast?

Wow, nifty.

 

[Ednoc]

Thank you all for your answer. It helps me a LOT in making a decision. I'm going to give a try to some retroclone or 4E. I'm going to talk about it with my players.