Bloodclaw Weapon + Furious Smash?

[Smeelbo]

Power (At-will): Free Action. Use this power before making a melee attack on your turn...increase the damage your target takes by...

At-Will, Martial, Weapon...Melee Weapon
Hit: Deal damage...

Furious Smash is a melee attack.
Furious Smash deals damage to its target.
Therefore, Bloodclaw's At-Will increases the damage your target takes.

Like attacking with a +1 Bloodclaw Halberd, for example.

Correct?

If not, how not? It "increases the damage the target takes," and is not a "bonus to damage rolls."

Smeelbo

 

[Jack99]

RAW vs RAI

It works as written, no doubt about that. I am not sure that it is supposed to, so that would vary from group to group. I wouldn't allow it (I think), but judging from the way many people play, many probably would.

 

[Black Knight Irios]

By RAW it is allowed.

By RAW stupid things are allowed.

Now ask yourself if you think that bloodclaw should work with furious smash.

The problem is not furious smash but bloodclaw.

 

[Smeelbo]

I don't really see a problem with this combination. So at low levels, Furious Smash goes from doing 3-4 points of damage to dealing 6-7 points of damage with a Halberd. At Paragon tier, call it 4-5 points upped to 13-14 points, is that problematic?

The problem I have with Furious Smash is that it does not appear to perform well compared to Aid Another in Combat, at least at low levels. A 50% of a +3 bonus to hit (being optimistic) is not as helpful as a near 100% chance of +2 bonus. The small amount of damage that FS deals does not seem enough to make it competitive.

Is it too good at higher levels then? Or what is the objection, besides "it's cheesy?" I have only played low Heroic Tier so far.

Smeelbo

 

[cjais]

The problem I have with Furious Smash is that it does not appear to perform well compared to Aid Another in Combat, at least at low levels. A 50% of a +3 bonus to hit (being optimistic) is not as helpful as a near 100% chance of +2 bonus. The small amount of damage that FS deals does not seem enough to make it competitive.

Here the problem is the ridiculously low, fixed DC of Aid Another, not Furious Smash.

I really hope Aid Another is on top of the their to-do list of things to errata.

 

[Smeelbo]

Here the problem is the ridiculously low, fixed DC of Aid Another, not Furious Smash.

I am not sure Aid Another is broken. You're giving up an attack, and a good chance of doing damage, in exchange for another attack having a better chance of hitting.

Stacking multiple Aid Anothers may be problematic, but if Aid Another becomes more like DC15 + 1/2 monster level, then you might as well just hit the monster than Aid Another.

Giving up an attack for a chance that another attack might not miss is a big trade-off. That is why I think Furious Smash might need some help.

I could be wrong, but that is my current thinking.

Smeelbo

 

[Mengu]

The problem I have with Furious Smash is that it does not appear to perform well compared to Aid Another in Combat, at least at low levels. A 50% of a +3 bonus to hit (being optimistic) is not as helpful as a near 100% chance of +2 bonus. The small amount of damage that FS deals does not seem enough to make it competitive.

I'm playing a warlord with Furious Smash. At low levels it is actually pretty decent damage, up to 7-8 points or so, when you add the damage bonus for the ally. I also often try to combine it with other damage such as hunter's quarry damage from warrior of the wild multiclass. Since the attack is vs Fort, it has a better chance to hit than my vs AC attacks, so there is a greater chance I'll be able to apply the HQ damage, especially with a flank. And the ally I'm flanking with gets a nice boost to his attack.

Also these little bonuses add up very quickly, for instance when our tielfing is hit in melee, I typically run to her aid with Furious Smash, because I know the next thing coming is an Infernal Wrath attack. When we pull off that combo, she's been known to hit on a roll of a 4 or so, and does oodles of damage.

At higher levels, the power is considerably better than aid another. At 14th level, Furious Smash is providing a bonus of +5 or +6 attack and damage, that's way better than a +2 attack.

 

[evilbob]

I'm with Smeelbo; I think it works that way and there's not anything wrong with it. (Well, unless you think Bloodclaw weapons are broken in general, in which case that's another argument/thread altogether.)

What's really cheesy is that the bloodclaw's power doesn't specify that the weapon you are wielding is granted the power bonus - so if you had a different magical weapon, and just had a bloodclaw dagger in your pocket, for example... But I don't think anyone would actually play that way in practice, because it's just too much cheese.

I know the AV specifies that any weapon property only applies to that specific weapon and only while it is being wielded; does it say anywhere that a weapon power only applies in a similar way as well?