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Bull rush into allies
- Thread starter komi
- Start date
MindWanderer
First Post
No. You cannot use forced movement to cause a collision.komi said:
That's what I thought. But is that how the rules describe it?
Bull rush allows you to do a push (p. 287).
You can't push a creature into a square that it couldn't walk into (p. 286). So, presumably the converse is true: if an ally can walk into it, he can be forced into it.
A creature can walk into a square with its ally (p. 283), even though he's not allowed to stop there.
So with this line of rationale, a creature can be forced into an ally's square because he could enter it himself. But this creates a situation that is seemingly undefined in the rules.
So I would guess it's not legal. Perhaps because of the fact that you can't end movement in an ally's square.
And note that this all assumes the ally is standing up. If he's prone, there shouldn't be any problem.
Bull rush allows you to do a push (p. 287).
You can't push a creature into a square that it couldn't walk into (p. 286). So, presumably the converse is true: if an ally can walk into it, he can be forced into it.
A creature can walk into a square with its ally (p. 283), even though he's not allowed to stop there.
So with this line of rationale, a creature can be forced into an ally's square because he could enter it himself. But this creates a situation that is seemingly undefined in the rules.
So I would guess it's not legal. Perhaps because of the fact that you can't end movement in an ally's square.
And note that this all assumes the ally is standing up. If he's prone, there shouldn't be any problem.
The simple answer likely is: a monster can be bull rushed through an ally, but not into him. Since he can't stop in an ally-occupied space, then the bull rush would have to be able to push him through the occupied space and into one beyond it. If that can't be done, then that space is invalid.
Dracollich
First Post
A similar situation like this came up last weekend during the KotS game I'm running.
The set-up: Thief of the group used Trick Strike against a Irontooth. He wanted to push the creature into one of its companions who was standing next to a wall. The effect he was going for was to have Irontooth collide with the smaller kobold who would then smack into the the wall.
My ruling: I asked the player to make a strength versus fortitude roll against Irontooth. He was successful and the kobold smacked into the wall for 1d6 pts of damage. (as an aside if there was no wall, a succesful str vs fort would have resulted in Irontooth taking the kobold's space, while the kobold gets pushed one square over)
Is this officially in the rules: no. Was it cool to happen in the game: yes.
From my brief glance at the DMG I do believe there is a section that covers unusual circumstances.
It took all of two minutes to come up with the solution and everyone enjoyed the results. You see, at that point in the combat, only the dwarf was in hand to hand combat with the kobolds while his companions were on the other side of the waterfall. The kobold started squabbling with his hated leader because of the invasion into his personal space and bought time for the dwarf to get away. Although it may seem like this story ends in a happy ending, it does not. A parting shot from the kobold warpriest layed the dwarf out in the stream.
The set-up: Thief of the group used Trick Strike against a Irontooth. He wanted to push the creature into one of its companions who was standing next to a wall. The effect he was going for was to have Irontooth collide with the smaller kobold who would then smack into the the wall.
My ruling: I asked the player to make a strength versus fortitude roll against Irontooth. He was successful and the kobold smacked into the wall for 1d6 pts of damage. (as an aside if there was no wall, a succesful str vs fort would have resulted in Irontooth taking the kobold's space, while the kobold gets pushed one square over)
Is this officially in the rules: no. Was it cool to happen in the game: yes.
From my brief glance at the DMG I do believe there is a section that covers unusual circumstances.
It took all of two minutes to come up with the solution and everyone enjoyed the results. You see, at that point in the combat, only the dwarf was in hand to hand combat with the kobolds while his companions were on the other side of the waterfall. The kobold started squabbling with his hated leader because of the invasion into his personal space and bought time for the dwarf to get away. Although it may seem like this story ends in a happy ending, it does not. A parting shot from the kobold warpriest layed the dwarf out in the stream.
