Burning Questions: How Do You Deal With Ludicrous Players?

Hello and welcome to another edition of Burning Questions. Today’s query: "In Dungeons and Dragons, how do you deal with players who constantly find ways of wrecking all of your planning as a DM with ludicrous actions no sane character would take?"

Hello and welcome to another edition of Burning Questions. Today’s query: "In Dungeons and Dragons, how do you deal with players who constantly find ways of wrecking all of your planning as a DM with ludicrous actions no sane character would take?"


The Short Answer

Regularly communicate with your players and attempt to resolve issues diplomatically.

The Long Answer

This has the potential to be great fun or render the game tedious. My DM style relies heavily upon improvisation and backup plans, but sometimes it's rather difficult to deal with the unpredictable and insane actions of an errant party.

When this type of thing pops up, I have a few ways of handling it. First, I’ll consider the character’s actions and determine whether it’s in-character for the PC to perform those actions. If it isn’t, then per the rules of the game, an alignment change may be in order. This can have adverse consequences on the character. For instance, a lawful good paladin decides to kill a blacksmith over the cost of a sword. This evil action is enough to throw the paladin from the grace of his/her deity and set them on a completely different path.

An alignment change doesn’t have to be a negative thing—it can be a new creative outlet for the player and their character and even drive the story into unknown territory.

Another great way I’ve found to handle this is to make it a part of the game or use it as a role-playing opportunity. Sometimes a character’s actions may be conducive to setting up an encounter in a different way or providing some additional plot elements to the story. If the rogue is engaging in outlandish behavior, they could be under the influence of a spell or some sort of magic item. It can be rolled into the character and create interesting elements of the game.

This is also an opportunity to take that player aside and ask them if their character would actually behave in such a way. If not, then ask them if playing that character is right for them.

This is tricky territory, because ultimately, players can—and likely will—do whatever they like in the name of fun. When that becomes disruptive, it's the game referee's job to get the game back on track, preferably in a mutually inclusive, friendly manner.

If it gets really out of hand, then an outside-the-game-discussion needs to happen. One thing I would rarely do is halt the game because the players did something unexpected, because that’s part of the appeal of D&D for me. Sometimes, though, the game has to end and everyone goes home.

This is a bit of an experiment and we’d love to know what our readers think about this topic in the comments. We’ll be back with another RPG Burning Question soon. Feel free to submit your own!

This article was contributed by David J. Buck (Nostalgia Ward) as part of EN World's Columnist (ENWC) program. When he isn’t learning to play or writing about RPGs, he can be found on Patreon or Twitter. We are always on the lookout for freelance columnists! If you have a pitch, please contact us!
 

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David J. Buck

David J. Buck

dwayne

Adventurer
Creativity and imagination coupled with the ability to think fast and a firm grasp of the spirit of the game and the rules. I have never came or have had a situation i could not handle and let me tell you there have been some WTF are you kidding me moments. It is almost always turn out to be awesome role play parts or a lesson in futility for the players on my end. I never punish a player for thinking out the box or foiling a plan i had in a way i didn't think of, that is part of the fun for me as a GM. But have had those who just do something because they can and have other motives that is not the way the class or character they had been playing would or should act or do. That's when you do what i call spank them give then a bloody noise in the game to make them think maybe this is not such a good idea. Then if they ignore the warning you let them have it but don't let the party fall with them, have to say has happened more than once and with the same person. I could tell you stories of his most fantastic deaths and to this day my old players still go on about him being sanded while jumping throw a diamond dust water fall in the underdark and other tales.
 

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Jason Pomfret

First Post
some good answers some ok answers none are wrong each depends on the group as a whole. I am the Ludicrous player but i am always playing within the charector and i have totally thrown many a DM a curve ball to totally of the edge of the story. Never do i do it intentionally For good or bad my charector are true to how they where established and approved by the DM. I just tend to come at things from a different angle than expected and can at times send us into hilarious situations fantastic new situations or have terrible consequences but doesnt that happen in real life as well.
 

the_redbeard

Explorer
"In Dungeons and Dragons, how do you deal with players who constantly find ways of wrecking all of your planning as a DM with ludicrous actions no sane character would take?"

DMs can't "plan" what is going to happen. They shouldn't even try.
DMs should only "plan" how NPCs will react. DMs should only "plan" the environment. Both of these are still subject to the provision D&D is an improvised, group activity - the goal is a challenging, fun time (how much is fun and how much is a challenge is a social question for the group.)

If there is a story in D&D it is what the players decide to do in a situation presented to them by the DM.

If a player is causing problems it is only because they aren't meshing with what the rest of the table wants to do.

I wonder if the player is the problem or if the DM is the problem.
 

Ace of Shadows

Savant Sage
Isn't it the primary function of good players to come up with ideas that wreck the DM's best laid plans to make life 'challenging' or 'uncomfortable' for their PCs? Some might saying successfully wrecking the DMs nefarious plans for the PCs is the whole point of the game.
 

Xaelvaen

Stuck in the 90s
It's all about intent.

The player who, not because of his or her character, but because of their own obnoxiousness, tries to intentionally go against the flow of the adventure and story, and even their fellow party members, is a bad egg. This needs to be addressed.

So this 'bad egg' decides to ignore the mayor's missing daughter that everyone else clearly wants to go after, and instead chooses to rob the Bar's storage cellar. There's a chance that player's character is a rogue who really doesn't care about the adventure, the story, and the plot - doesn't care about the companionship of the group, or the reward the mayor is offering and just wants a bigger personal payday, or the thrill of stealing something, sure. However, an insightful DM can tell when the player is just being intentionally contrary, especially when a session 0 has been established, and the entirety of the group agreed upon specific stipulations:
Generally goodly aligned
Cooperative Gameplay
Etc

That sort of disruptive behavior isn't the sort of thing I agree with just 'rolling with the punches' and making in character consequences, because it's taking time away from the greater whole, and more than one person is suffering - your entire group is, which was likely the intended goal of the disruptive player in the first place.

However, the other type of disruptive action, which is just a player being incredibly clever and 'breaking your careful planning' with an amazingly well-thought-out action, should not only be met by the DM easily adapting to the change in their plans and the melding of the story, but an appropriate reward as well. Crazy actions of death-defying risk and courage aren't the bane of DMs 'careful planning', but the exact point of careful planning - like a master whose student surpasses them, this should make you proud, not leave you feeling foiled.
 

Totally agreed. There’s a world of difference between someone doing something/not doing something because of established character personality traits, and someone that just comes up with a rando action because they think it’d be funny, or even purposefully trying to sabotage the game.

I’ve played with those sorts of players, and let me say, I don’t play with them now. Not saying D&D can’t be funny, because heck yeah it is. But when a character is only defined so far as a conveyance for jokes and whatever bizarre impulses spring into a player’s mind, no thank you.

It's all about intent.

The player who, not because of his or her character, but because of their own obnoxiousness, tries to intentionally go against the flow of the adventure and story, and even their fellow party members, is a bad egg. This needs to be addressed.
 

Xaelvaen

Stuck in the 90s
Not saying D&D can’t be funny, because heck yeah it is.

On this note, we ran a Galavant inspired campaign after the first season (link included in case people weren't aware of it). It's a musical tv series set in a fantasy genre that absolutely cracked us up.

No one was allowed to play an actual 'Bard' in that we were all musically inclined and occasionally had to belt out into song (as was the nature of the world), even the baddies did it too - a truly hilarious campaign I will treasure for ages to come.
 

Jay Verkuilen

Grand Master of Artificial Flowers
It's all about intent.

The player who, not because of his or her character, but because of their own obnoxiousness, tries to intentionally go against the flow of the adventure and story, and even their fellow party members, is a bad egg. This needs to be addressed. <...> That sort of disruptive behavior isn't the sort of thing I agree with just 'rolling with the punches' and making in character consequences, because it's taking time away from the greater whole, and more than one person is suffering - your entire group is, which was likely the intended goal of the disruptive player in the first place.

This is a very good explanation of griefer-type behavior.


However, the other type of disruptive action, which is just a player being incredibly clever and 'breaking your careful planning' with an amazingly well-thought-out action, should not only be met by the DM easily adapting to the change in their plans and the melding of the story, but an appropriate reward as well. Crazy actions of death-defying risk and courage aren't the bane of DMs 'careful planning', but the exact point of careful planning - like a master whose student surpasses them, this should make you proud, not leave you feeling foiled.

Unfortunately the players being super outside the box isn't something a DM just easily adapts to. :heh:

I agree, though, that it's often cool and a DM who stomps on this too much isn't going to be fun to be around. DMs need to realize that their plans are loose approximations and that "no plan survives contact with the enemy." If you did a bunch of prep and the players avoid that area, chances are good you can recycle it in some other place. In other cases, just recognize that not everything you plan will show up, just like not everything that gets filmed in a movie ends up in the final cut. You thought the players would end up in a big slugfest but they decided to negotiate or sneak around instead? That's cool.

However... there is a way in which "out of the box" thinking can start merging back into griefing and other disruptive behavior. For example, if the players are trying to exploit RAW in a way that is pretty clearly against RAI. Players who do this can often be very disruptive and end up provoking a rules lawyer type argument. One skill DMs need to learn and groups need to work to reinforce is handling questions like that in an efficient manner, for instance the DM saying "OK, that works this time, but we'll try to sort it out between sessions" or something like that.
 

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