Capping a game at 11th-level

[Kzach]

I've often wondered what it would be like to play in a setting that had a significantly lower level-cap than standard fantasy faire. In 4e, 11th-level is quite powerful in comparison to 1st-level, so there would still be a disparity between your haves and have-nots, however the disparity would not be so large as to make anyone god-like. Even an 11th-level PC could be brought down by enough 1st-level minions.

It's also before things get out of hand with flying and teleportation and other game-breaking spells and tricks. Not to mention it cuts off just before the math of the system starts to get wonky.

11th-level also allows one level of a paragon path and so could be representative of a significant leap in power, both systematically and thematically. Call it a 'name' level.

Of course, you would have to lower XP gains to slow advancement to a near crawl, but I don't necessarily see that as a bad thing, at least not with the right group who would place roleplaying before combat.

Anyway, I was curious to see what people's reactions would be to something like this.

 

[BobTheNob]

I think it would be a group by group decision, but I see this as not only achievable, but I wholely agree with your observations.

Heroic just seemed smoother than the rest of the game and re-jigging the campaign world so that 11="GodLike" is just an issue of ajustment.

I think this would work no worries. If you get around to doing it, let us know how you go

 

[Dice4Hire]

I think the game can be capped at any level, depending on the group's needs and desires.

Personally in 4E I would go for 12th, but that is a small difference.

But it is a good idea.

 

[Nemesis Destiny]

I am actually doing this right now for one specific story arc that I am running. I'm just testing the waters, but I think it will work well.

For a game like this, you could borrow from E6 and have additional XP "levels" beyond 11th grant bonus feats, a retrain, and possibly another minor benefit, like a skill bonus.

 

[Lostdwarf]

I don't know that you would have to slow advancement all that much. A level is usually 8-9 encounters in the games I have run, plus a quest bonus and/or a skill challenge. Ten levels of that is 80-90 encounters. Depending on how often you play, and how long your sessions are, that can be a ton of gaming. Many groups don't meet every week, and I find that my groups in the past got through 2-3 encounters plus some rp time each session. If we average total encounters to 85 to advance 10 levels and say we average 2.5 complete encounters per session, thats 34 session. Even gaming every week thats more than half a year. If you are gaming twice a month its more than a year of play to get through.

I think groups that make it from 1 to 30 without breaking up are the rare exception rather than the rule. Gaming a teir at a time is probably a good goal.

 

[fba827]

once, my group ended a campaign at 10th level. though we ended up doing a little stint afterwards for 2 more levels after the original campaign was technically over.

the different tiers have the POTENTIAL to have very different feels like books (though I recognize not all groups/campaigns play it that way) so it's just a matter of perspective as to where you want to end it.

it doesn't really make a difference, though it can just be tempting to some players who see all the paragon and epic stuff and start drooling over it. but if everyone is on board, and that's really where you feel it would fit more comfortably for what you have in mind, go for it.

Personally, I actually think along the same lines as Dice4Hire in that I think a campaign can end at any level, so it's all good to me....

A good juxtaposition might be to end your current campaign at 11th and then the next campaign starts at 11th (set in a new world/new story/new PCs/etc).

 

[Quickleaf]

Well my last campaign was strictly heroic tier (10th level cap) and also strictly world bound (no planar travel). It was a succession crisis tightly revolving around defeating the main villainous pretender to the throne. Since it only lasted a year gaming twice a month, I didn't need any special advancement rules. It worked well.

I also had designed the whole setting around the assumption that there were only a handful of NPCs in low paragon levels. Many encounters seemed to have gobs of minions, and a one point I think a player said their 'minion kill tally' was nearing 200. At 9th level the PCs were basically eye to eye with princes and famous knights, and were able to face down a fettered dracolich and an entire banner of 35-50 men themselves.

 

[Chzbro]

I just ended a campaign at 13th level. Our next it slated to run to 16.

At first, paragon level was rough for me (as it was my first time personally designing and building paragon encounters). PC power seemed like it had quickly gotten out of hand. Fortunately, that didn't last and the last few sessions proved to be a lot of fun.

For all the reasons the OP noted, we're not particularly interested in taking it all the way to epic, but (in my opinion) going a few levels into paragon makes the PCs feel like they've grown to be pretty powerful and allows for a satisfying conclusion to a campaign.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Agreeing that you could cap at any level you so chose...as long as your players were cool with it.

Personally, were I to run a 4Ed campaign with a cap, I'd cap just below Epic. But that's me- I like the way Paragon plays out, some of the new powers & feats sing to me.

 

[S'mon]

I always cap at 10th (E10) in 3e now, since my first experience of teen-level 3e was traumatic.

For 4e I think a lower cap than 30 is fine, but the way the game is structured I think that as a player I would not like E11. E11 would mean I have to deal with all the complexity of Paragon play, without the pay-off. I would much rather be told "This is an Heroic Tier world" and have PCs cap at E10, making 10th 'name level'. I'd like it if mortal NPCs capped at 10th too, but it's not vital in 4e, unlike 3e - a 10th level 4e PC is about as powerful as a 14th level standard monster. Rituals and magic items should also stick to the cap, though, with exceptions being Artifacts.