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<blockquote data-quote="Wyvern" data-source="post: 379868" data-attributes="member: 2374"><p><strong>chapter 5</strong></p><p></p><p>As for the why: back when this project first got going, the general consensus was that we wanted to create a system that was flexible enough to work in any environment imaginable, and to handle crossovers between environments. The medium rules allow you to create an amphibious spaceship for use on a waterworld, or to take a trip to the elemental plane of water, or even to create a cosmos where "outer space" is filled with liquid ether. By reducing all possible environments into three categories, we can dramatically increase flexibility with only a little added complexity.</p><p></p><p>As for the how: I purposely designed it so that working different media into the vessel creation rules is as simple as listing what media different components work in. For example, rocket engines will work in air or vacuum, but not in fluid, whereas a propeller-driven vehicle will work in fluid or air, but not vacuum. You only need to worry about external components, of course.</p><p></p><p>Again, adding this to the vehicle design rules is as simple as defining what field(s) of technology particular components require. So a rocket engine, instead of being listed as "Tech 5", is "Engineering 5, </p><p>Chemical 5". The reason for this is to allow the system to be easily used in cosmoses where the dominant culture is especially advanced (or lagging behind) in a particular area of technology. The same applies to magic, so you can reflect the fact that a world which has particularly advanced necromantic magic, for instance, is more likely to develop lifejammers. If you think this is too much work, I'd be quite happy to do it myself once I have a copy of the vessel component list.</p><p></p><p>Okay, that sounds good. I'll make the change when I do the next revision of the chapter.</p><p></p><p>Exactly.</p><p></p><p>If the magic potential drops the caster level below the minimum required to cast a particular spell, it can't be done. So for instance, in a cosmos with magic potential 5, an 8th-level sorcerer drops to caster level 7 and loses access to his 4th-level spells, since he needs to be level 8 to cast them.</p><p></p><p>The problem of caster level being reduced to 0 or less is something I hadn't considered. I'll have to work on that.</p><p></p><p>I'm not sure what the problem is here. All magic items are supposed to have a caster level listed, so either they'll work normally, or at reduced effectiveness, or not at all, depending on the item and the ambient magic potential.</p><p></p><p>I admit it's kludgy, but there's a specific reason why I did it that way. The problem with simply saying "in a cosmos with low magic potential, high-level spells don't work but low-level spells work normally" is that it limits high-level magic users but doesn't affect low-level ones at all. This is counter-intuitive; either a low magic potential should affect novice casters *more* than the powerful ones, or it should affect them all equally. If you can think of a mechanic that allows this besides the one I've got, I'll be glad to consider it.</p><p></p><p>I also wanted to reflect the feeling that magic is more uncertain in a cosmos with a low magic potential. Requiring Spellcraft checks only for spells exceeding the potential level doesn't do that, because the inhabitants of that cosmos wouldn't have developed those spells anyway (since achievement level can't exceed potential level).</p><p></p><p>Hmm... maybe a partial solution would be to allow achievement levels to exceed potential levels where the potential is flexible, but require Spellcraft/Use Device checks for the higher levels. I'll have to play around with that idea and see what comes of it.</p><p></p><p>Good point here. I need to think some more about the possible ramifications of doing it that way, but I think I'll probably change it.</p><p></p><p>I thought I *did* make it clear in the initial discussion and definition of achievement and potential levels, that the inhabitants of a cosmos don't necessarily reach the maximum potential tech or magic level. I'm not quite sure why you're confused.</p><p></p><p>Yes it is. See <a href="http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd.html" target="_blank">http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd.html</a></p><p></p><p>That reminds me of something I was wondering about, though. Is this project going to be under the d20 license or just the OGL? Because if it's the latter, I think we'll need to replace all references to the DMG with references to "core rulebook II" and so on.</p><p></p><p>If he wants to take a whack at it, that's fine by me.</p><p></p><p>I don't see what you mean.</p><p></p><p>"Slow Suffocation" is the term used in the DMG, and I think we should stick to that term to avoid confusion and make it easier for people to look up the details, such as how long an air supply lasts. I didn't see a need to copy everything from the DMG (although I might add the bit about the effect of character size on oxygen consumption). Also, I think the rules in the DMG work great, and I don't see any need to change them. Slow suffocation from oxygen depletion (as opposed to drowning or being smothered with a pillow) is, as the term implies, a slow process.</p><p></p><p>Since genasi are, AFAIK, the only type of creature that this would apply to, I don't know that it's worth worrying about. Especially since we can't mention them without violating the OGL. I should probably add a rule stating that undead, constructs and elementals are immune to vacuum damage, though.</p><p></p><p>Well, I think Sidran is right about Europa possibly being covered in frozen oceans of some sort (it's hard to be sure when all you have to go on are photos taken from space). I don't think it could be entirely liquid, though -- from what I understand of current theories on how planets are formed, that's just not possible.</p><p></p><p>Fine with me.</p><p></p><p>Thanks. <img src="data:image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhAQABAIAAAAAAAP///yH5BAEAAAAALAAAAAABAAEAAAIBRAA7" class="smilie smilie--sprite smilie--sprite1" alt=":)" title="Smile :)" loading="lazy" data-shortname=":)" /></p><p></p><p>Wyvern</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Wyvern, post: 379868, member: 2374"] [b]chapter 5[/b] As for the why: back when this project first got going, the general consensus was that we wanted to create a system that was flexible enough to work in any environment imaginable, and to handle crossovers between environments. The medium rules allow you to create an amphibious spaceship for use on a waterworld, or to take a trip to the elemental plane of water, or even to create a cosmos where "outer space" is filled with liquid ether. By reducing all possible environments into three categories, we can dramatically increase flexibility with only a little added complexity. As for the how: I purposely designed it so that working different media into the vessel creation rules is as simple as listing what media different components work in. For example, rocket engines will work in air or vacuum, but not in fluid, whereas a propeller-driven vehicle will work in fluid or air, but not vacuum. You only need to worry about external components, of course. Again, adding this to the vehicle design rules is as simple as defining what field(s) of technology particular components require. So a rocket engine, instead of being listed as "Tech 5", is "Engineering 5, Chemical 5". The reason for this is to allow the system to be easily used in cosmoses where the dominant culture is especially advanced (or lagging behind) in a particular area of technology. The same applies to magic, so you can reflect the fact that a world which has particularly advanced necromantic magic, for instance, is more likely to develop lifejammers. If you think this is too much work, I'd be quite happy to do it myself once I have a copy of the vessel component list. Okay, that sounds good. I'll make the change when I do the next revision of the chapter. Exactly. If the magic potential drops the caster level below the minimum required to cast a particular spell, it can't be done. So for instance, in a cosmos with magic potential 5, an 8th-level sorcerer drops to caster level 7 and loses access to his 4th-level spells, since he needs to be level 8 to cast them. The problem of caster level being reduced to 0 or less is something I hadn't considered. I'll have to work on that. I'm not sure what the problem is here. All magic items are supposed to have a caster level listed, so either they'll work normally, or at reduced effectiveness, or not at all, depending on the item and the ambient magic potential. I admit it's kludgy, but there's a specific reason why I did it that way. The problem with simply saying "in a cosmos with low magic potential, high-level spells don't work but low-level spells work normally" is that it limits high-level magic users but doesn't affect low-level ones at all. This is counter-intuitive; either a low magic potential should affect novice casters *more* than the powerful ones, or it should affect them all equally. If you can think of a mechanic that allows this besides the one I've got, I'll be glad to consider it. I also wanted to reflect the feeling that magic is more uncertain in a cosmos with a low magic potential. Requiring Spellcraft checks only for spells exceeding the potential level doesn't do that, because the inhabitants of that cosmos wouldn't have developed those spells anyway (since achievement level can't exceed potential level). Hmm... maybe a partial solution would be to allow achievement levels to exceed potential levels where the potential is flexible, but require Spellcraft/Use Device checks for the higher levels. I'll have to play around with that idea and see what comes of it. Good point here. I need to think some more about the possible ramifications of doing it that way, but I think I'll probably change it. I thought I *did* make it clear in the initial discussion and definition of achievement and potential levels, that the inhabitants of a cosmos don't necessarily reach the maximum potential tech or magic level. I'm not quite sure why you're confused. Yes it is. See [url]http://www.opengamingfoundation.org/srd.html[/url] That reminds me of something I was wondering about, though. Is this project going to be under the d20 license or just the OGL? Because if it's the latter, I think we'll need to replace all references to the DMG with references to "core rulebook II" and so on. If he wants to take a whack at it, that's fine by me. I don't see what you mean. "Slow Suffocation" is the term used in the DMG, and I think we should stick to that term to avoid confusion and make it easier for people to look up the details, such as how long an air supply lasts. I didn't see a need to copy everything from the DMG (although I might add the bit about the effect of character size on oxygen consumption). Also, I think the rules in the DMG work great, and I don't see any need to change them. Slow suffocation from oxygen depletion (as opposed to drowning or being smothered with a pillow) is, as the term implies, a slow process. Since genasi are, AFAIK, the only type of creature that this would apply to, I don't know that it's worth worrying about. Especially since we can't mention them without violating the OGL. I should probably add a rule stating that undead, constructs and elementals are immune to vacuum damage, though. Well, I think Sidran is right about Europa possibly being covered in frozen oceans of some sort (it's hard to be sure when all you have to go on are photos taken from space). I don't think it could be entirely liquid, though -- from what I understand of current theories on how planets are formed, that's just not possible. Fine with me. Thanks. :) Wyvern [/QUOTE]
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