With all of the talk about various powers, I thought it would be great to get it organized and see what people think.
The point of this thread is to compare a cleric's powers to each other. For example, what 3rd level encounter power really strikes people as awesome, and which ones do they think are garbage?
This thread is for the cleric only, other classes will be handled in other threads.
My initial take:
Level 1 At-wills
I think the cleric at wills are pretty balanced. Sacred Flame I think tops the list, as its temp hp tends to scale very well at higher levels. However, lance of faith is a solid buff. I think the weakest one is priest's shield, AC bonuses are nice, but I would rather use righteous brand and get a nice big attack bonus. All in all, every power has good use.
Level 1 Encounter
On the strength side, it looks pretty good. Healing Strike = More Healing = More good. Dazing effects are great, so wrathful thunder is fine. On the wisdom side, I think cause fear is the red headed step child of this group. Divine Glow is one of the few cleric AOE's, and it gives your buddies a buff a long with it. Cause Fear can generate OA's, but it takes some very specific position to use it, and causes no damage on its own. Further, the character can move away and still attack in many cases.
So in this batch, I think cause fear is weak.
Level 1 Daily
I think the dailies are well balanced. Beacon of Hope and Guardian of Faith are sturdy abilities that have a general effect on the whole combat. Avenging Flame and Cascade of Hope work in slightly different ways. Avenging Flame has a much stronger ongoing effect. In many cases you won't get to use the effect of COH, because by the time you attack again, the creature will have made its save and won't be vulnerable to your attack anymore. But COH does more initial damage. So all in all a good set.
Level 2 Utility
Bless and Shield of Faith are both great buffs for an entire fight. I think Divine Aid is pretty weak. Divine Aid is nice until you look at sacred flame...and at-will power that can generate saves. Generally I prefer shield of faith to sanctuary, but a +5 bonus to all defenses is a massive increase, and it has a range of 10, great for delaying to right after the fighter goes and then giving him a huge bonus for a whole round of combat.
In general Cure Light Wounds is my least favorite. On the one hand, more healing = more good. On the other, I don't think the need to healing a character without surges is that big a deal. I could instead use shield of faith, a permanent +2 to AC for my party for the fight is likely to "heal" them far more than one CLW.
Level 3 Encounter
I like all of these as well. Blazing Beacon is designed for a more ranged oriented party, but for those groups that are designed that way +4 is a huge bonus. Command is just wonderful. Daunting Light does a nice amount of damage, and Split the Sky is a good status effect power.
Level 5 Daily
Once again all the powers look good. 3 of the powers all have a general effect on whole of one combat. Rune of Peace doesn't last as long, but the ability to completely shut down a creature's attack is very strong, especially since its a strength attack vs Will, which is a rare....so its very likely to hit.
Level 6 Utility
While CLW doesn't seem that good to me, Cure Serious Wounds is nice, as its a big heal, healing over half a person's hitpoints with one action. Or you can go with bastion of health, getting weaker but more frequent healing as a minor action
Compared to those two, I think Divine Vigor is pretty crappy. I know what they are going for, afterall its an effect that can help the whole party. But...the party has to have used its surges, they all have to be close by, and they all have to use their standard actions to get any benefit out of it...AND they don't get the cleric's wisdom bonus on the heailng (even though the spell has the heailng keyword, it doesn't actually heal anything itself). So unless you have a party of dwarves I wouldn't touch that power with a 10 foot pole.
And last is Holy Lantern. Certainly not as sexy as the others, but it has its place. Bonuses to skills are always good, especially perception...the most common skill in most games. But you have to give up some nice healing spells to get it. I think its useful in a skill heavy game, for most games its not worth it. But if skills are what you are going for, you can't beat it.
Level 7 Encounters
For the wisdom ones, you have Break the Spirit vs Searing Light. Now BtS does a little more damage, and a -cha mod to their attack rolls is great...except that Searing Light BLINDS THEM! Blind is an instant -5 to attack rolls, and that's assuming the person knows what square to attack. Now Bts is a Will Defense, which some may like for the mixup, but I think Searing Light is a better power.
Awe Strike vs Strengthen the Faithful comes down to accuracy vs raw power. StF is flat out better, more damage, and tremendous healing. However Awe strike is a strength attack vs will instead of AC, and that can make a big difference in the attack roll. Overall, I think StF is a better power, but wouldn't blame someone for wanting the consistency of Awe Strike.
Level 9 Daily
Blade Barrier and Astral Defender are both ongoing effects that have different uses. The greatest thing about BB is that its AUTOMATIC DAMAGE!!! Just plop the wall down on your enemy, and he takes 3d6 + wisdom damage...not save no defense, just eat it. The astral defenders are more mobile, and do radiant damage which is always great when facing undead.
Divine Power's Effect is so damn good, I would consider it even if I had no strength. +2 AC for the party, and regen 5...yes please.
And lastly we have flame strike. AOE, great ongoing damage...but I don't think it holds a candle to blade barrier. Blade Barrier you can mold to your likeing, it can last the whole fight, it does more initial damage and of course....AUTOMATIC DAMAGE! Flame Strike can miss, in which case it deals a lot less damage....BB is always going to start off awesome, and your party can use other movement effects for even more damage. I think Flame Strike is garbage comparatively
That's all for now, feel free to post your thoughts about the cleric powers and how they stand up to each other.
The point of this thread is to compare a cleric's powers to each other. For example, what 3rd level encounter power really strikes people as awesome, and which ones do they think are garbage?
This thread is for the cleric only, other classes will be handled in other threads.
My initial take:
Level 1 At-wills
I think the cleric at wills are pretty balanced. Sacred Flame I think tops the list, as its temp hp tends to scale very well at higher levels. However, lance of faith is a solid buff. I think the weakest one is priest's shield, AC bonuses are nice, but I would rather use righteous brand and get a nice big attack bonus. All in all, every power has good use.
Level 1 Encounter
On the strength side, it looks pretty good. Healing Strike = More Healing = More good. Dazing effects are great, so wrathful thunder is fine. On the wisdom side, I think cause fear is the red headed step child of this group. Divine Glow is one of the few cleric AOE's, and it gives your buddies a buff a long with it. Cause Fear can generate OA's, but it takes some very specific position to use it, and causes no damage on its own. Further, the character can move away and still attack in many cases.
So in this batch, I think cause fear is weak.
Level 1 Daily
I think the dailies are well balanced. Beacon of Hope and Guardian of Faith are sturdy abilities that have a general effect on the whole combat. Avenging Flame and Cascade of Hope work in slightly different ways. Avenging Flame has a much stronger ongoing effect. In many cases you won't get to use the effect of COH, because by the time you attack again, the creature will have made its save and won't be vulnerable to your attack anymore. But COH does more initial damage. So all in all a good set.
Level 2 Utility
Bless and Shield of Faith are both great buffs for an entire fight. I think Divine Aid is pretty weak. Divine Aid is nice until you look at sacred flame...and at-will power that can generate saves. Generally I prefer shield of faith to sanctuary, but a +5 bonus to all defenses is a massive increase, and it has a range of 10, great for delaying to right after the fighter goes and then giving him a huge bonus for a whole round of combat.
In general Cure Light Wounds is my least favorite. On the one hand, more healing = more good. On the other, I don't think the need to healing a character without surges is that big a deal. I could instead use shield of faith, a permanent +2 to AC for my party for the fight is likely to "heal" them far more than one CLW.
Level 3 Encounter
I like all of these as well. Blazing Beacon is designed for a more ranged oriented party, but for those groups that are designed that way +4 is a huge bonus. Command is just wonderful. Daunting Light does a nice amount of damage, and Split the Sky is a good status effect power.
Level 5 Daily
Once again all the powers look good. 3 of the powers all have a general effect on whole of one combat. Rune of Peace doesn't last as long, but the ability to completely shut down a creature's attack is very strong, especially since its a strength attack vs Will, which is a rare....so its very likely to hit.
Level 6 Utility
While CLW doesn't seem that good to me, Cure Serious Wounds is nice, as its a big heal, healing over half a person's hitpoints with one action. Or you can go with bastion of health, getting weaker but more frequent healing as a minor action
Compared to those two, I think Divine Vigor is pretty crappy. I know what they are going for, afterall its an effect that can help the whole party. But...the party has to have used its surges, they all have to be close by, and they all have to use their standard actions to get any benefit out of it...AND they don't get the cleric's wisdom bonus on the heailng (even though the spell has the heailng keyword, it doesn't actually heal anything itself). So unless you have a party of dwarves I wouldn't touch that power with a 10 foot pole.
And last is Holy Lantern. Certainly not as sexy as the others, but it has its place. Bonuses to skills are always good, especially perception...the most common skill in most games. But you have to give up some nice healing spells to get it. I think its useful in a skill heavy game, for most games its not worth it. But if skills are what you are going for, you can't beat it.
Level 7 Encounters
For the wisdom ones, you have Break the Spirit vs Searing Light. Now BtS does a little more damage, and a -cha mod to their attack rolls is great...except that Searing Light BLINDS THEM! Blind is an instant -5 to attack rolls, and that's assuming the person knows what square to attack. Now Bts is a Will Defense, which some may like for the mixup, but I think Searing Light is a better power.
Awe Strike vs Strengthen the Faithful comes down to accuracy vs raw power. StF is flat out better, more damage, and tremendous healing. However Awe strike is a strength attack vs will instead of AC, and that can make a big difference in the attack roll. Overall, I think StF is a better power, but wouldn't blame someone for wanting the consistency of Awe Strike.
Level 9 Daily
Blade Barrier and Astral Defender are both ongoing effects that have different uses. The greatest thing about BB is that its AUTOMATIC DAMAGE!!! Just plop the wall down on your enemy, and he takes 3d6 + wisdom damage...not save no defense, just eat it. The astral defenders are more mobile, and do radiant damage which is always great when facing undead.
Divine Power's Effect is so damn good, I would consider it even if I had no strength. +2 AC for the party, and regen 5...yes please.
And lastly we have flame strike. AOE, great ongoing damage...but I don't think it holds a candle to blade barrier. Blade Barrier you can mold to your likeing, it can last the whole fight, it does more initial damage and of course....AUTOMATIC DAMAGE! Flame Strike can miss, in which case it deals a lot less damage....BB is always going to start off awesome, and your party can use other movement effects for even more damage. I think Flame Strike is garbage comparatively
That's all for now, feel free to post your thoughts about the cleric powers and how they stand up to each other.
