D&D 3E/3.5 Complaining about 3.5 weapon size rules

[Storyteller01]

This is just a debate. Enter at your own risk though...

Maybe everyone out there can help me out. I don't understand why 3.5 actually has rules for 'small' weapons? A small longsword is, mechanically a shortsword, yes?? Why complicate matters?

In the real world, weapons (unless custom made) are built to be used by a variety of people. This includes short swords used by adults and children during times of war, as well as rifles and AK-47 used 13 year olds of hunting or times of war.

Wouldn't the samre premise count here? Or wouldn't it be the same if a human picked up a weapon made for a large creature. Why confuse the issue?

 

[John Q. Mayhem]

I rather like the 3.5 rules, and think that the weapon sizing is more realistic. A short sword designed for someone with hands half as big as yours is not going to be comfortable to use; it'll be too thin and the pommel and guard will dig into your hand. Likewise, a longsword for an ogre will have a signifigantly thicker hilt than a human greatsword, and will be weighted as a longsword, not a greatsword. I allow weapons to be made for multiple size categories, but it costs +50% of the base price. So for 75 gp you could get a sword that could be used as a Medium greatsword, a Large longsword, or a Huge shortsword.

 

[Aust Diamondew]

A shortsword, a longsword and a greatsword are all weighted much different from each other. A shortsword is not weighted to be a longsword for someone who is 3 feet tall. Nor is the handle the right size (way too big). Now if you want to change things in your game just to make it easier I can understand that. But you cannot make the argument that in real life a short sword desigend for a 10 foot tall man can be used by me as a longsword effectively.

 

[Kabol]

Well the new system is more realistic.

A Small Longsword is NOT a short sword - they are fundementaly differant weapons - Slashing vs Peircing - Threat Range - And that just in DnD Mechanics

But - From a Player perspective - its much more of a pain in the but when dealing with loot from non-med size mobs.

 

[cignus_pfaccari]

But - From a Player perspective - its much more of a pain in the but when dealing with loot from non-med size mobs.

One way of dealing with that is to play something with a "daisho"-style ability, like the OA samurai or the Ancestral Relic feat. While those half-dozen +1 Small Shortswords aren't usable to you, they're easily usable by the samurai or exalted guy to power up his weapons.

Also, they're still saleable if you have small races you can trade with.

Brad

 

[SteelDraco]

When 3.5 first came out, I remember reading a similar thread. I tended toward the 3.0 weapon size rules, until one post changed my mind.

I wish I had saved the image, but it showed Ahnold, from the Conan movie, holding a huge, thick dagger above his head. It showed, quite clearly, the difference between a Huge dagger and a greatsword. They're not shaped the same at all, or weighted similarly, or designed to be wielded in anything resembling the same style. A giant can pick up a greatsword sized for a Medium person and try to use it like a dagger, but it's not optimal - it's just not designed to be used in that manner.

Yes, the current weapon rules cause problems for the small races. But think about it - a halfling is the size of, roughly, an eight-year-old human child. How often is a child a signicant threat to an adult? A halfling may be much stronger, but they're still really, really little.

 

[Storyteller01]

A shortsword, a longsword and a greatsword are all weighted much different from each other. A shortsword is not weighted to be a longsword for someone who is 3 feet tall. Nor is the handle the right size (way too big). Now if you want to change things in your game just to make it easier I can understand that. But you cannot make the argument that in real life a short sword desigend for a 10 foot tall man can be used by me as a longsword effectively.

Why not? Japanese have swords with a 2 foot handle and a 5 foot blade. The handles are simple in design (to help facilitate in constant but subtle changes in grip). It is a simple matter for a larger creature to use it one handed (it is effectively an oversized katana) provided the wielder is conscious of the differences.

A weapons damage is due, in part, because of its mass. So wouldn't it be said that short longsword and a shortsword possess the same weight?
The difference in peirceing vs slashing is just a matter of changing the blade angle in relation to the hilt and where the weight is placed in the weapon itself.

Also, a longsword and greatsword (I believe) both have the majority of their weight placed near the hilt, at the weapons center of gravity.

 

[BelXiror]

It's not necessarily the length of the grip that matters, as the girth.

When a grip is too big around to hold it properly, when you hit things the weapon can rotate in your grip accidentally. or just plain bounce out of your grip.

I remember when I was a kid and trying to use a regular sized cricket bat. It didn't work. At all. Every time the ball hit the edge of the bat, I couldn't grip it well enough to stop it from rotating.

The same can be said of grips too small. One, when holding something thin for too long, my hand starts to cramp, the second is that I can't get a good grip, like above, and whatever I'm holding rotates. I've had this happen with squash rackets and undersized kids cricket bats.

Not too mention, if it's too small, when you swing something it can shoot out of your hand cause you can't hold it tight enough...

 

[Hypersmurf]

So wouldn't it be said that short longsword and a shortsword possess the same weight?
The difference in peirceing vs slashing is just a matter of changing the blade angle in relation to the hilt and where the weight is placed in the weapon itself.

So you're saying that a Small longsword can be treated as identical to a shortsword, as long as you take out the blade, rebalance the weapon, and reinsert the blade at a different angle?

By that token, I can say that a quarterstaff is really the same as a handaxe, as long as you chop off four or five feet, whittle the diameter down a bit, and add an axeblade...

-Hyp.

 

[Bladesong]

I solved the problem by getting rid of all the short races. I never much liked "comedy relief" in my fantasy anyway. Many an old fantasy cartoon was ruined by some small, silly character.