D&D 3E/3.5 Complaining about 3.5 weapon size rules

[The Souljourner]

In 3.5 they also clarified how reach weapons work for non-medium sized combatants... they double the user's natural reach, while preventing attacks inside the user's natural reach. That means that tiny and fine creatures do not benefit from reach weapons. Doubling their natural reach of 0 does nothing.

Small reach weapons being wielded in one hand is the one oddity of the system. However, given that you're doing less damage *and* get -2 to hit *and* only get 1x your strength bonus... it's really not a big deal.

Given all the problems it fixes - most importantly, that 3.0 can't handle anything other than medium sized weapons, I think the single oddity is well worth the benefit.

-The Souljourner

 

[FireLance]

I was hoping to find better quotes, but I can't. Reach weapons only double the normal reach for Large and larger creatures:

BIG CREATURES
Large or larger creatures with reach weapons can strike out to double their natural reach but can't use their weapons at their natural reach or less.

The section on very small creatures does not specifically say that Tiny, Dimunitive and Fine reach weapons give 5 feet of reach, but does hint that they are possible:

VERY SMALL CREATURES
Tiny, Dimunitive and Fine creatures have no natural reach. They must enter an opponent's square (and thus be subject to an attack of opportunity) in order to attack that opponent in melee unless they are armed with weapons that give them at least 5 feet of reach.
Because Tiny, Dimunitive and Fine creatures have no natural reach, they do not normally get attacks of opportunity. Specific creatures may be exceptions, and some may carry reach weapons that do threaten adjacent squares.

Emphasis mine.

 

[Storyteller01]

Yeah... I know... and that's EXACTLY what 3.5 did. It just did all the math for you. BAM! Tons of small weapons.

I honestly don't understand what the problem is that people have with weapon sizes. It's not complicated, it makes sense, it doesn't interfere with gameplay, and it fixes a *lot* of problems.

How were you outfitting giants in 3.0? Surely they weren't all walking around with greatswords-as-daggers? You probably extrapolated custom huge sized clubs, swords, etc. Well, in 3.5, the work's been done for you.

How were you outfitting small races in 3.0? All they could use were shortswords and daggers, pretty much. Kinda sucky, no? Can't use all those neat exotic weapons, or just the odd martial ones, like rapiers and lances.... so you probably extrapolated out some custom small sized weapons for those guys. Well, in 3.5, the work's been done for you.

-The Souljourner

My problem is (such as it is ) is that WotC wants me to pay $120 dollars or more (roughly $40 a book) for minor rules changes that had relegated as GM fiat for the last 25 years. If common sense can't answer this kind of problem, then come up with a nonsensical one. Don't sting your customs over little details. They could just as easily written "The complete book of little guys and gals" with this info printed in it.

The previous system was good. It didn't cover every detail, so the GM and the players had room to do what they wanted. If you GM allowed a wizard to wield a Greatsword, Hey GO FOR IT (Just means you have to spend a move action to pick up your weapon after casting a spell).

 

[Saeviomagy]

My problem is (such as it is ) is that WotC wants me to pay $120 dollars or more (roughly $40 a book) for minor rules changes that had relegated as GM fiat for the last 25 years. If common sense can't answer this kind of problem, then come up with a nonsensical one. Don't sting your customs over little details.

If you've really got it covered, and they're not problems to you, don't buy the new books.

Der.

OTOH, I for one like the fact that a company updates their rules system. I mean really - what would you rather? WotC's 3.5, or call of cthulu's 6th (is that right?) edition, which is, for all intents and purposes, identical to their 1st edition.

 

[Storyteller01]

OTOH, I for one like the fact that a company updates their rules system. I mean really - what would you rather? WotC's 3.5, or call of cthulu's 6th (is that right?) edition, which is, for all intents and purposes, identical to their 1st edition.

Then update the rules as needed ], and remember that streamlining is just as important as content. 2.0 came out with optional rules for the system. Afterwards, 2.0 suffered from extreme options (what do I do for this? Each book says something different.) so 3.0 (after Hasbro bought TSR) came out with 3.0. Now we need a 3.5 for the same reason. How long before we go to 4.0?

In retrospect, Rifts hasn't changed it's system since it started. People still enjoy playing it (granted, it is a complicated system, but a weapon is a weapon, and you are allowed to use dragons and draon sized weapons)

 

[dcollins]

How were you outfitting giants in 3.0? Surely they weren't all walking around with greatswords-as-daggers? You probably extrapolated custom huge sized clubs, swords, etc. Well, in 3.5, the work's been done for you.

How were you outfitting small races in 3.0? All they could use were shortswords and daggers, pretty much. Kinda sucky, no? Can't use all those neat exotic weapons, or just the odd martial ones, like rapiers and lances....

No, not sucky. It's actually more believable that small races have restricted choices, because weaponsmiths are presumably not churning out wagonloads of special half-sized exotic weapons. I actually consider that a more compelling "realism" argument than than the my-hilt-isn't-scaled-right business.

For giants, the work was also already done for us in 3.0. The weapons are right in the MM stat blocks. So there's no advantage to 3.5 in that regard either.

 

[Hypersmurf]

If you GM allowed a wizard to wield a Greatsword, Hey GO FOR IT (Just means you have to spend a move action to pick up your weapon after casting a spell).

Well, no, you just hold it in one hand while you cast.

Like you do with a staff.

-Hyp.

 

[John Q. Mayhem]

If you want to update from 3.0, or just want the 3.5 books, get the boxed gift set from Amazon. It's only $60, and you get free shipping.

IMC most Medium light weapons and Small one-handed and two-handed weapons are made with the house rule I mentioned in my post on page 1.

 

[Spatula]

In 3.5 they also clarified how reach weapons work for non-medium sized combatants... they double the user's natural reach, while preventing attacks inside the user's natural reach.

The same text is present in the 3.0 PHB (and as FireLance says it only applies to Large or larger creatures).

 

[BelXiror]

No, not sucky. It's actually more believable that small races have restricted choices, because weaponsmiths are presumably not churning out wagonloads of special half-sized exotic weapons. I actually consider that a more compelling "realism" argument than than the my-hilt-isn't-scaled-right business.

Unless, of course, they are small weaponsmiths, who make small weapons, for small people.