• The VOIDRUNNER'S CODEX is LIVE! Explore new worlds, fight oppressive empires, fend off fearsome aliens, and wield deadly psionics with this comprehensive boxed set expansion for 5E and A5E!

D&D 5E Confessions of a guilty conscience DM

guachi

Hero
It kind of sounds like to the player the encounter was just... tedious and pointless and then your character just gets worse, and your only defense is to read the adventure before you play it?

It's tedious if the DM does a bad job describing what's going on. The meal should be rather odd and give the PCs a sense of just how strange and everything is. At the beginning of D&D there were many players who loved the gambling aspect of the game. Push every button; twist every knob. It's essentially no different than the gamble you make when you fight a monster. Are you going to win? If so, how much treasure do you get?

And the benefits are rather fantastic:
Increase max HP 1-4 or have nothing happen.
Cure every disease, poison, blindness, and restore all HP.
gain 1-2 points for one ability and lose 1-2 points for one ability at random
you are immune to starvation or you have to eat 2x as much
gain +4 to all future saves vs. poison or die (eep!) of poisoning
get drunk
can cast ESP once a week (if you fail the save. lol) or nothing
become a ghost on a failed save or nothing.

My main objection is that there is no way you can possibly determine what food might be beneficial or not. It's a total gamble.
 

log in or register to remove this ad


Teflon Billy

Explorer
Wow. You made it sound like you railroaded that poor player straight to the bottom of the 9 hells. So the end result was a somewhat less optimized character that was otherwise OK stemming from actions voluntarily taken by the player? .

Seriously. I had to re-read the post a couple of times to figure out exactly what we were talking about here.

Here's an example of my DM'ing to make you feel a little better about yourself.

In our current campaign, a player left the game for personal OOG reasons about a year back, the in-game explanation was that he had been captured by a enemy from his background and sold into slavery (thinking that when the Player was ready to return he'd "lead a slave uprising" and return to the main continent)

A few weeks real time later, the PC's met a Green Hag that would become their arch enemy over the next few levels. Her ability to go invisible at will, disguise herself as anyone coupled with her wretched cockney accent and the fact that she worse human skin as clothing really made the PC's hate her. Her willingness to flee invisibly and leave her minions to be slaughtered made the PC's really hate her.

So about a year of real time later I contact the player who bowed out and asked if he's like to rejoin the group for one night. Playing his character...

Who was in fact the Green Hag in disguise leading a well-disguised group of Wight mercenaries to lay waste to the player's home town.

delicious :)
 

My main objection is that there is no way you can possibly determine what food might be beneficial or not. It's a total gamble.

That is why its called gambling. Some situations in the game, such as combat are different kinds of gambles, much like blackjack is whole different game than playing the slots.

The feast encounter is a slot machine. So is a deck of many things. Other risky situations are like blackjack or poker, in which skill and strategy may affect the outcome.

The feast situation in this module is completely voluntary. No character is compelled to eat ANY of the food. So if you choose to gamble and then lose, you cannot blame the DM for the outcome. If your character sheet and what's on it are so very precious that you cannot stand to see anything happen to it then DON'T gamble.
 

thedmstrikes

Explorer
So, I have been a DM for over twenty years. My actions in game are responsible for the character deaths of more PCs than I can remember. In truth, even more deaths are due to the actions of the PCs themselves, not my machinations. I had a party implode over the palming of a single ring (which was actually cursed) and they were only third level. That campaign lasted all of three weeks. I had a first level character encounter green slime while scouting ahead and did not recognize it for what it was, so I tried to give hints that something was drastically wrong by declaring that he hears sizzling coming from his boots. Instead of turning back, he chose to go forward toward the door at the end of the hall, which turned out to be a false door (bonus points if you know the 1E module this came from). The slime ate him, no evidence was left. I had another player tear his character sheet in half after an unfortunate fall into a vat of acid that he personally survived, but ate almost all of his magical possessions (he was a mage). The result was straight from the book and combined with his dice rolls. He never returned. I am not above retconning a mistake on my part and have done so repeatedly. For example, in Rappan Athuk, the first time I ran the module, I failed to prepare properly and the first level badass creature encountered the party. Well, I did not completely read the entry to notice that they had 0 chance of defeating the creature so gave no such hints that their characters were in mortal danger, until someone threw a spell at it and I read the SR followed by the DR entry. This was after one of the PCs had already become stuck to a pseudopod that slammed him. I allowed the guy to escape and they ran away (which was the ONLY way to defeat the badass). It mattered not because they never made it out and I have been unable to convince another party to enter the halls of the Dungeon of Graves since.

Do I sleep well at night? Yes, absolutely. If it is my mistake, I fixed it. If the characters die because of their choices, well, it is a game after all and someone just lost. Fortunately, there is a reset button of sorts and new characters can join at anytime (something I became very good at, introductions). It did bother me when in party fighting or real life damaged the group. In hind sight and with the experience of age, I have come to learn that not every member of a group can be salvaged. Sometimes, a party member will need to leave for the betterment of the group. If you think feeling bad about a poor decision or a bad die roll sucks, try asking someone to leave your house and never return. That took me a while to get over.

I am not even going to talk about what I did to the gnome sharpshooter (splatbook, the one and only time I allowed it) or the elven archer (from 2E). Those two are probably responsible for the survival of their groups. At least in those cases the problem was mostly with the players and not the rules, or rather the players inability to completely read their rules and abused my trust that they did...anyway...I do have a confession:

Dave Cornwell, your flying PC in the late 90s did have the ability to kill the dragon I was desperately trying to save. His last minute dive to avoid your spell was a plot device to save him for later, not a saving throw. It was my fault for not remembering your Wings of Flying. I had not realized anyone even possessed the ability to go after him, let alone bring him down! My belated congratulations and a thank you for handling it so well at the time.
 

Rhenny

Adventurer
I was running my Ghosts of Dragonspear Castle campaign, but only 2 players could make it. Instead of postponing the game I let the 2 pcs take their black dragon hatchling and scout ahead in the Lizard Marsh. This would give the fighter a chance to try to train the black dragon hatchling.

Well, I decided to use the random encounter tables in the adventure. Going out the pcs only encountered 4 giant frogs. They could handle that pretty easily. On the way back, they encountered 8 Bullywugs. (The pcs were only 2nd level). I had the fighter roll charisma checks to command the dragon so it only responded a few times during the fight. Then the fighter went down, but there was only 1 bullywugs left. Instead of having the bullywug run, I had it attack the other pc (a monk). It rolled 2 critical hits! Well, the fighter failed 3 death saves. The monk (who had a potion of healing) rolled a 20 and revived right when the fighter died.

I felt bad about that one. I didn't know that bullywugs got 2 attacks per round so 8 of them vs 2 pcs was a very tough fight. I should have just had that last bullywugs run.
 


redrick

First Post
I was running my Ghosts of Dragonspear Castle campaign, but only 2 players could make it. Instead of postponing the game I let the 2 pcs take their black dragon hatchling and scout ahead in the Lizard Marsh. This would give the fighter a chance to try to train the black dragon hatchling.

Well, I decided to use the random encounter tables in the adventure. Going out the pcs only encountered 4 giant frogs. They could handle that pretty easily. On the way back, they encountered 8 Bullywugs. (The pcs were only 2nd level). I had the fighter roll charisma checks to command the dragon so it only responded a few times during the fight. Then the fighter went down, but there was only 1 bullywugs left. Instead of having the bullywug run, I had it attack the other pc (a monk). It rolled 2 critical hits! Well, the fighter failed 3 death saves. The monk (who had a potion of healing) rolled a 20 and revived right when the fighter died.

I felt bad about that one. I didn't know that bullywugs got 2 attacks per round so 8 of them vs 2 pcs was a very tough fight. I should have just had that last bullywugs run.

These, for me, are the toughest moments. When the wrongs befalling a character are not so unjustified that I can comfortably hand-wave them away, but where the players weren't doing something so stupid that you can easily say, "Next time, Ray, when somebody asks if you're a god, say yes."

When my first-level party listened came to a fork in the dungeon, advanced to a door, and heard the voices of "a whole bunch of big, tough hobgoblins," I didn't feel bad for what happened to them after they kicked down the door and ran into 7 hobgoblins.

When my 3rd level party heard one voice through a curtain, and opened it to see a group of big orcs, I felt a little bad for not pointing just how big and nasty the orcs were. (1 orc war chief (CR 4), 1 Orog (CR 2), 2 CR 3 NPCs and 3 regular orcs.) They just barely escaped a TPK and left 2 characters to die. Not so bad that I didn't have them roll up new characters, of course.

Just because I kill foolish PCs for a hobby doesn't mean I always have to like it. Is all I'm saying.
 

Voidrunner's Codex

Remove ads

Top