Conversion: 4E to 3e (lol)

[Bohemian Ear Spoon]

OK, seriously not meaning to start any flames, in fact, consider this thread entirely dispassionate, I am looking for answers of a mechanical nature, not Messianical or even Maniacal for that matter.

Proposal: To take the character/monster/magic core rules and de-evolutionize them to fit into the (I don't know the proper term) milieu? classic myth-base? Basically traditional and original atmosphere 'setting' created by E.G.G with his GreyhawK campaign expansions, i.e: the core races, the daily-based spell rules, class structure, etc. In other words, the things that linked the original published game thru all of its incarnations until this 4th Edition.

Even as I ask, lol, I realiaze the prejudice of the question. Who is to judge what does and doesn't fit the milieu whatever that means? Surely not I, and the one man who could possibly give judgement is dead.. coincidence? (joking, you gits) So the question and this post are rendered nonsense I guess. But darnit! I love the minions, the per-encounter type actions, the explicit grid rules-system, the look, the monsters, the shadowfell (cool!) but I HATE HATE HATE dragonkin, no Druids (weeps) monks or others, warlocks meh but ok, warlord WTF! that class does not make sense to me in a DOES NOT MATCH REALITY sort-of-way.

Sheesh, so all I really wanted to know is would it be possible to have an expansion to 4E along the lines of "Classic Setting' or somesuch, so that the Conan/Vance/LotR purists at heart may still enjoy this new release? I mean the basic mechanical rules of 4E but with the core classic elements brought back, and the new expletives left behind.

 

[UngainlyTitan]

Not entirely sure what you want, but I think it is 4e with vancian casting. Well you could but you are throwing out all class balance. It would also be a ton of work.

the straight 3e wizard increases too fast for 4e. Initially the wizard is weaker but when he starts getting stuff like stoneskin, greater stoneskin and save or die spells he leaves the rest in the dust.

Now if you want to run a 1e flavour campaign with 4e I think that is dooable, especiallly in the magic.
One of the things i always really liked about D&D is that there was a lot of non- combat and ward type spells.
Alll of these can be brought back as rituals. I suspect WoTC plans to sell them back. But unseen servant, sepia snake sigil, firetrap, guards and wards, sanctum and so forth can be rituals. I would use the 3e research rules with some working as to the costs to allow the players create their own rituals.

 

[Doc Eldritch]

Actually, after playing a few games of 4e and reading the rules, as interesting as the game is and as fun as the games I played were, it is missing something I can not put my finger on. So, I am putting 4e aside and picking up 3e and WFRP again.

But! I do plan to pull ideas from 4e to 3e. The poison rules? Check. The disease rules? Check. Minion rules? Check. Heck, we were using the Book of Iron Might to give fighters a leg up long before we heard about 4e's 'everyone has powers' approach. Probably some other odds and ends from 4e I will nab for 3e games too.

I like 4e, and maybe when I can put my finger on what exactly it is missing for me, I'll pick it up again. And if I find a good online game of it, I would definitely not pass it up! I definitely think it has a lot to offer to other games, and I will pillage it mercilessly for ideas!

 

[Dice4Hire]

Bohemian, that post was pretty confusing.

I am thinking of the sname thing as previous posters, though. My group jsut started doing 4E, though those of us in the group who follow games carefully have done a lot of talking about it.

And we do agree that something is missing. Not sure what it is, but maybe for us it is the sense of unique characters. We liked multiclasing, and going for odd prestige clases, and our 3.5 games cycled through the levels, characters nad settings pretty rapidly. But 4E is not that.

On the other hand, two of us really like tactical combat, and 4E offers that, to an extent. Yes, it is wildly tactical, but it is all combat. Combat combat combat, is all the game seems to offer. And all it handles well.

We are still up in the air, but it is looking probable that we will tkae some 4E stuff and start making a hybrid system that incorporates 3.5 and 4E. I might play both of htem as is online, but at home, I think a messy hybrid is onthe horizon.

 

[Bohemian Ear Spoon]

I think we might be seeing the same thing. I havent actually played, but the basic mechanics of it sound well, really good. It is mainly the more flavorful, or I guess you might say "iconic, archetypal" aspects that I find jarring.

Maybe there is some interest in a project "to update the 4E ruleset to tradtional Gygaxian D&D, and would mainly focus on class, race changes, as well as all the silly tidbits like sunrods et al. Hmm what exactly else would a traditional "campaign setting" contain, and COULD it be done with the current ruleset? Or conversely, make a "3E compliant" conversion of 4E?

And, in additiion, would such a thing be allowed under the GSL or whatever lol? Or would it be OGL? GSL? D20? **hack hack**