Converting monsters from Dungeon Magazine

[Shade]

Been looking at the old description, and it seems to me that only the grappling appendages (tongue and tentacles) have adhesive. Would it be enough to rewrite the adhesive description to remove references to things getting stuck to the house hunter itself? And does that change anything about the grapple?

A rewrite should be fine. Since the grapple would still be initiated by tongue or tentacle attack, the grapple should remain unchanged.

(hp for tentacle/tongue – Y-5/10, Ad-10/20, An-15/30 – I’d say the tongue is much bigger, stronger, and tougher than the tentacles)
(withdraw – if it loses two appendages? Or maybe if it loses the tongue or both tentacles?)

I like the values you listed, and would suggest the latter option for withdraw.

(like the mimic, probably just repeated damage with the crushing member. Did we rule that both the tongue and tentacles crush? If so, we should probably list both damages as “X points of damage with its tongue or X points of damage with a tentacle” or something like that)

I don't think we made a ruling. The suggested method of listing both sounds good.

(size – is it necessary to list the size if it is the next category smaller?)
(crush – Y-2d6+6, Ad-2d8+10, An-2d8+14 - usually 2d6 or 2d8 with a + maybe Str bonus?)
(acid – Y-1d8+X, Ad-2d6+X, An-2d8+X - varies a lot, sometimes 8 or 12 sometimes a range like 1d8, 2d6, and 2d8 with a + )
(damage to gut – Y-20, Ad-25, An-35 – seems to be based on size – Huge is 25, Gargantuan is 35, Colossal is 50)
(gut’s AC – Y-15, Ad-16, An-17 – is 10 plus ½ natural armor)

Either list specific size or just state "at least one size category smaller than itself".

Crush: I like your values, with Str bonus.

Acid: I'd just go with 1d8, 2d6, and 2d8 with no "+".

Gut values look good.

Sound Imitation (Ex): A house hunter can mimic any voice or sound it has heard, as a free action. Listeners must succeed on a Will save (DC X) to detect the ruse. The save DC is Charisma-based.

(Y-15, Ad-19, An-24)

Yep, that's straightforward.

 

[BOZ]

If its really buggin' you, go ahead and change it.

I think I will. tentacle just makes more sense to me…


Skills:
I don’t imagine they’re going to spend anytime hiding – they want to be seen. and that would be a big waste of ranks anyway.

How about these set-ups for ranks?

Young
Skills: Climb +2, Disguise +3, Listen +3, Spot +3

Adult
Skills: Climb +2, Disguise +4, Listen +4, Spot +4, Survival +4

Ancient
Skills: Climb +4, Disguise +6, Intimidate +6, Listen +6, Move Silently +6, Search +6, Spot +6, Survival +6

A rewrite should be fine. Since the grapple would still be initiated by tongue or tentacle attack, the grapple should remain unchanged.

so, how about:

Adhesive (Ex): A house hunter exudes a thick slime from its tongue and tentacles that acts as a powerful adhesive, holding fast any creatures or items that it hits. A house hunter automatically grapples any creature it hits with a tongue or tentacle attack. Opponents so grappled cannot get free while the house hunter is alive without removing the adhesive first.

(A weapon that strikes an adhesive-coated house hunter is stuck fast unless the wielder succeeds on a DC X Reflex save. A successful DC X Strength check is needed to pry it off.)
we could keep an altered version of this paragraph for use with sunder attempts, if that still makes sense. It may not be necessary though.

Strong alcohol dissolves the adhesive, but the house hunter still can grapple normally. A house hunter can dissolve its adhesive at will, and the substance breaks down 5 rounds after the creature dies.

I like the values you listed, and would suggest the latter option for withdraw.

actually, looking at it again and thinking about it – does it make sense for the creature to withdraw from combat at all if the appendages grow back in 1d4 rounds?

 

[Shade]

I think I will. tentacle just makes more sense to me…

Cool.

Skills:
I don’t imagine they’re going to spend anytime hiding – they want to be seen. and that would be a big waste of ranks anyway.

How about these set-ups for ranks?

Young
Skills: Climb +2, Disguise +3, Listen +3, Spot +3

Adult
Skills: Climb +2, Disguise +4, Listen +4, Spot +4, Survival +4

Ancient
Skills: Climb +4, Disguise +6, Intimidate +6, Listen +6, Move Silently +6, Search +6, Spot +6, Survival +6

Lookin' good.

so, how about_:

Adhesive (Ex): A house hunter exudes a thick slime from its tongue and tentacles that acts as a powerful adhesive, holding fast any creatures or items that it hits. A house hunter automatically grapples any creature it hits with a tongue or tentacle attack. Opponents so grappled cannot get free while the house hunter is alive without removing the adhesive first.

(A weapon that strikes an adhesive-coated house hunter is stuck fast unless the wielder succeeds on a DC X Reflex save. A successful DC X Strength check is needed to pry it off.)
we could keep an altered version of this paragraph for use with sunder attempts, if that still makes sense. It may not be necessary though.

Strong alcohol dissolves the adhesive, but the house hunter still can grapple normally. A house hunter can dissolve its adhesive at will, and the substance breaks down 5 rounds after the creature dies.

I think the "weapon stuck" paragraph can be ditched altogether.

actually, looking at it again and thinking about it – does it make sense for the creature to withdraw from combat at all if the appendages grow back in 1d4 rounds?

Probably not, considering its speed.

 

[BOZ]

LOL OK, posted in homebrews. this is one nice long post…

 

[Shade]

Man, I wish we were getting paid by the word.

First off, why "house hunter mimic"? Was "house hunter" too cheesy for you? Did it remind you of something on TLC or HGTV?

Suggested CRs:

Young 5
Adult 7
Ancient 9

For mimic shape, the mimic is Large and can assume the general shape of any object that fills roughly 150 cubic feet (5 feet by 5 feet by 6 feet). Using a similar calc based on size, how about...

Young 150 cubic feet (5 feet by 5 feet by 6 feet).
Adult 1,100 cubic feet (10 feet by 10 feet by 11 feet).
Ancient 3,600 cubic feet (15 feet by 15 feet by 16 feet).

 

[BOZ]

Man, I wish we were getting paid by the word.

don’t you know it! “diarrhea of the word processor” is part of what made Stephen King rich.

First off, why "house hunter mimic"? Was "house hunter" too cheesy for you? Did it remind you of something on TLC or HGTV?

heheh. MC Annual 1 refers to them as “Mimic, House Hunter”. I decided to keep that reference, but I didn’t want to be clumsy with “Mimic, House Hunter, Young” and the like. is “House Hunter Mimic” too unwieldy?

Your CR's seem a bit low. Keep in mind, they have a lot more HP than a typical mimic and a wider range of abilities. How about:

Young: 6-7
Adult: 10-12
Ancient: 13-15

Or are those too high now? do we have something to compare to?

I’m fine with your dimension calculations – I wasn’t even going to begin trying that. now of course, these creatures aren’t (nearly) cubic and therefore skinnier, but who the hell cares your figures are good enough.

As far as weight, I’d assume they weigh less than an actual building (bony exosekelton filled with muscle), but still do weigh much more than the average person can lift.

 

[Shade]

don’t you know it! “diarrhea of the word processor” is part of what made Stephen King rich.

heheh. MC Annual 1 refers to them as “Mimic, House Hunter”. I decided to keep that reference, but I didn’t want to be clumsy with “Mimic, House Hunter, Young” and the like. is “House Hunter Mimic” too unwieldy?

Your naming convention sounds fine. When I first saw "house hunters", I thought "deadly realtors".

Your CR's seem a bit low. Keep in mind, they have a lot more HP than a typical mimic and a wider range of abilities. How about_:

Young: 6-7
Adult: 10-12
Ancient: 13-15

Or are those too high now? do we have something to compare to?

That seems high to me. Basically, I took a standard mimic, and added +1 CR for every 4 HD (since its an aberration), and gave 'em an additional +1 for a few extra abilities. They aren't really that much better than a standard mimic.

Get us playtesters, stat!

I’m fine with your dimension calculations – I wasn’t even going to begin trying that. now of course, these creatures aren’t (nearly) cubic and therefore skinnier, but who the hell cares your figures are good enough.

I just hope my figures allow them to be as big as a house of the appropriate size!

As far as weight, I’d assume they weigh less than an actual building (bony exosekelton filled with muscle), but still do weigh much more than the average person can lift.

Yeah, they are chitinous goo-bags.

 

[BOZ]

That seems high to me. Basically, I took a standard mimic, and added +1 CR for every 4 HD (since its an aberration), and gave 'em an additional +1 for a few extra abilities. They aren't really that much better than a standard mimic.

OK, I see your point and I see what you are looking at (MM p 294). You forgot the +1 for every size increase over Large. this would apply to the two older varieties.

Also, the suggestions on p. 302 for an “Ambusher” type of monster, of which a standard mimic is one type, suggest that the CR should be ½ HD to total HD.

So, I want to go with:

Young: 5
Adult: 8
Ancient: 11

I just hope my figures allow them to be as big as a house of the appropriate size!

hmm, on second thought maybe we should enquire further?

 

[Shade]

OK, I see your point and I see what you are looking at (MM p 294). You forgot the +1 for every size increase over Large. this would apply to the two older varieties.

I didn't forget it, I just misunderstood it. The way it is written is misleading:

"Size increased to Large or larger = +1 to CR"

"Generally, increasing a monster’s size increases its combat effectiveness. Large creatures gain increased Strength, reach, and other benefits. Apply this modifier if you increase a creature beyond Medium and in conjunction with any other increases."

I got the impression that increasing from Medium to anything larger entailed a one-time +1 CR adjustment.

Also, the suggestions on p. 302 for an “Ambusher” type of monster, of which a standard mimic is one type, suggest that the CR should be ½ HD to total HD.

Now that is clear as water.

So, I want to go with:

Young: 5
Adult: 8
Ancient: 11

Sounds good.

hmm, on second thought maybe we should enquire further?

Nah, I think we're OK. 1,100 square feet is pretty sweet for a cottage. And 3,600 is almost double the size of my house.

 

[BOZ]

I got the impression that increasing from Medium to anything larger entailed a one-time +1 CR adjustment.

I see how you could take it that way, but I think it makes more sense to keep adding it with every change. The bigger the badder right?

And OK, we’ll keep your calculations for dimensions if you’re sure about them. I’m terrible with stuff like that.