Creating a magic item question

[Arcanus]

Okay how would you create a tome or book (or whatever you want to call it) that could give you permanent ranks in skills or feats like the Tomes of Understanding, Manuals of Gainful Excercise, etc... which give you permanent boosts in your ability scores?

Can you do this?
What would it take and how much would they cost to create?
What would be the market value of them?
I'm sure the feat books would cost more at least.

How long do you think someone should have to read them to
get the abilities?

 

[Dr_Rictus]

In general, there is no magic that gives you ranks in skills. Bonuses, sure. Ranks, no. That would be a much bigger-than-normal variant.

 

[mkletch]

Considering that you get a new feat every three levels, and a new ability score point every four, I would figure that you could get a feat with a wish or miracle.

You'd have to put a limit on it, though. You get 5 ability score points by 20th level, and six feats (not counting the ability scores and feats you start with). So, you could get up to six feats through the use of wishes, I guess. I'm sure that you could work in some skill ranks (but not beyond you max ranks, I would presume), but I'm going to go through that exercise now.

And if you can get it with a wish, it would seem that you could get it with a one-shot book (since we have precedent). That seemed pretty easy...except for those that worship at the altar of Game Balance.

-Fletch!

 

[kreynolds]

Can you do this?

In regards to the skills part, not really. Magic items don't give ranks. They give bonuses. What you can do, however, is create a magic item that gives you an inherent bonus, much like a Tome of Understanding.

What would it take and how much would they cost to create?
What would be the market value of them?

Well, the cost of a normal item that gives a +5 competence bonus to a single skill would cost you roughly 500gp. An inherent bonus, however, should be more expensive. I'm thinkin' somethin' like bonus squared x 200gp, or maybe even bonus squared x 250gp. That would give us final totals of 5,000gp and 6,250gp, respectively.

I think that's a fair price for a bonus that is permanent and unaffected by magic or antimagic. The cost to create the item would be half the cost I listed above, and 1/25th the cost in XP.

How long do you think someone should have to read them to
get the abilities?

Half the time of a standard magical Tome, so 24 hours over a minimum of 3 days.

I'm sure the feat books would cost more at least.

I have no idea. Those can be a real pain to price out. Cool idea though.

 

[Hypersmurf]

Wizards of the Coast provided a precedent for a spell granting access to a feat. Only certain feats, true, but it's something to work from.

Make it permanent and inherent, and you've got your feat book...

-Hyp.

 

[Arcanus]

So with the Mirror Move spell, someone with high enough levels in Wizard/Sorcerer could make the spell persistent and get feats that would last 24 hours.

Thats not a bad idea when you might be planning on casting Tensers Transformation.

Okay so what I am looking for here is a way to make Tomes/Books that give inherent bonuses to skills or feats.
I think we have the Skill book figured out for pricing and stuff.
The Feat books though might be a problem deciding how to price it and stuff.

I am thinking that the creator should have to cast the spell Mirror Move from the WoTC website's Spellbook section. Somehow needing to make it permanent maybe with the spell or Wish/Miracle spells also.

So far all that I can think of for Feat Book pricing is using the same for the +1 - +5 inherent ability score book prices.
Making it only so you gain a maximum of +5 feats that you still have to meet the prereguistes for.
Not sure on if the pricing would be too low or not around 30,000 gold pieces for an inherent feat.
Maybe each time you gain a feat you pay a more expensive cost like with the price differences of the inherent ability score books.

what do you think

 

[Number47]

An easier way is to lower the price some by having the feat predetermined. If the book only gives Iron Will, for example, the price should be significantly less. Even if it gives a groovy feat like Spring Attack, the only ones who can benefit are those who already qualify for the feat.

If the book granted any feat chosen by the user, well that is hard to price. Not all feats are equal. Especially if you use all the feats from various books.

 

[Hypersmurf]

An easier way is to lower the price some by having the feat predetermined.

Hey, I like that - especially if you're using Mirror Move as the prereq. Then the creator would have to have a "model" to observe while crafting... or have the feat himself.

Far more DM-controllable as well, for random treasure books.

-Hyp.

 

[Arcanus]

Yeah the pre-determined thing sounds cool, and would make a great random treasure item.

You might also get away with having the book not be pre-determined and use Mirror Move as the main spell for the creation.
The reader would have to watch someone with the feat being used while reading the book or after reading the book to gain the new feat.

This would still leave alot of control in the hands of the DM.
He could also be evil and say you gain the first feat you see after the book was read.

Now the question is how much would it cost to create this item that was A: a pre-determined feat and B: a non-predetermined feat? So how much is the market value for each if the fantasy setting was in A: a high magic with moderate inflation levels and a struggling economy not dependent soley on magical goods.
and B: me not clowning around how much would market and creation values be?