Rystil Arden said:
Rystil Arden said:
Well first, most elves aren't Masks, only the wizards are and that's a small percentage of actual elves. That aside, you are absolutely right that there is a fine distinction between chattel slaves and helots. Helots actually weren't allowed to acquire wealth (that was the Perioikoi), but instead sent all the surplus food and resources to the Spartiates, allowing the Spartans to keep a well-trained standing army with those resources that was the envy of all Greece until they were defeated by Epimenondas and his Sacred Band strategy. But helots weren't chattel, they were more like serfs, tied to the land. In fact, no society had both a helot class and chattel slaves because there was no need for both, one of the two groups was sufficient (ancient societies did have hostage-slaves and conquered-slaves, but these were treated significantly better than chattel slaves and often allowed to gain positions of high status and power, despite belonging to the master, often adopting the name of their master like Terence, the famous Roman playwright of The Andrian Girl, who was a Greek slave adopted by a guy named Terentius). Chattel slavery is a relatively-modern concept that was the result of a centuries-long expansion of colonialism and imperialism that may well have had its roots in the 12th century by the writings of the Norman historian William of Malmesbury, who was the first to view fellow Christians as inferiors and barbarians, resurrecting Classical racial views in a world that had for the most part been divided into Christian/non-Christian up until his writings. Whether William was the catalyst or not, the actual practise of chattel slavery didn't show up until much later.Tonguez said:
I would actually say that while I agree with you on most of your "non-weapon weapons," I'm going to have to disagree on the hunting-bow for most agricultural societies. Indeed, even in relatively lenient cultures that allowed the lower class to have bows (one of the few weapons that they could easily be trained to use, like in Henry V's successful Agincourt strategy), all the best hunting areas were generally owned by the nobility, with strict hunting laws imposed on those who would go hunting in the nobles' forests. So really, the lower class probably has no business with a hunting bow except in non-agricultural hunting cultures or if they're allowed weaponsTonguez said:
Cool, I think that with the tweaks to fit in with previous racial comments that it now fits perfectly in as a model for the low-level foundations of a conqueror-based civilisation.Tonguez said:
Half-elves seem to be perfectly fine, particularly House Kiron half-elves, and a player who wants to play an elf could play as an elf who lived in House Kiron lands (since they freed their Masks, they probably also gave higher status to their Villeins, especially since they went and married some of them). Dwarves don't seem to be outlawed so much as dwarven culture an language, a fine distinction but an important one. Loyal dwarves are fine, but it seems like the opinion is that having their own culture breeds their separatism. Its similar to how in Nennius's account of the Historia Brittonum the Britons who come to Gaul and establish the land of Brittany take Gaulish wives, but they cut out the wives' tongues to prevent their children from learning the language (ouch!), so that they could keep their British culture.domino said:
