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d20 Future - Ship Sensors

Masada

First Post
Aside from gaining a bonus to attack rolls, ship sensors seem to provide little other value. I'm having trouble even finding sensor ranges. Has anyone put together something listing sensor ranges and possible other uses?
 

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Ralts Bloodthorne

First Post
I've got them somewhere, but can never remember what I did with them, but here are some quick and rough things to use.

Sensor Classes range from I to X, with I-III being the normal civilian range, IV-VII being high end luxury/corporate systems, while VII-X are military sensor systems. Multiply standard prices in the (F)MSRD by 1-10 for the approximate price.

Now, sensors range from passive light gathering to full blown multi-particle sensing with active reflection absorbtian rate scanning. As for uses, my players have used them to do deep scans of debris, derelict ships, space stations, asteriod and planetiod crusts, etc; sweeping for survivors/power sources in a wrecked ship; pushing the power past preprogrammed safety limits and using thier active sensors to burn out the sensors on enemy ships; and the normal stuff of tactical data during battles and hooking into planetary nets during combat.

What kind of information did you want?
 

Masada

First Post
I started a draft of something like this...

Sensor Range Increments
All sensor systems have range increments based on PL. All systems have a maximum range of 5 increments. Each increment beyond the 1st imposes a -2 penalty to function check made at that distance.

PL 5 range increment: 1000 miles (Max 5,000 miles)
PL 6 range increment: 5000 miles (Max 25,000 miles)
PL 7 range increment: 20,000 miles (Max 100,000 miles)
PL 8 range increment: 50,000 miles (Max 250,000 miles)
PL 9 range increment: 100,000 miles (Max 500,000 miles)

Planetary systems or space stations can put much more power behind their systems. Multiply the range increment of a stationary sensor system by 100. This only applies to detailed scan results. Stationary systems can detect object (ships) at a range of 8 trillion miles (about the size of our solar system) if they know where to look (i.e. they receive a transmission from the ship) and the ship is not shadowed by another object.

Proximity alarms
Most starships systems routinely scan the immediate range for objects on a direct collision course with the ship. They will also sound when another identifiable starship (an object with a detectable energy signatures) approaches with in immediate range.

...and then I'm going to continue to draft how you can defeat sensor systems. Using them to burn out other systems is a nice touch... But mostly I'm trying to pin down how far away a ship might detect you, how to determine when a ship is "looking" and what you can do to fool them. I'd rather not create more feats, but rather add more options to skill checks.
 

GuardianLurker

Adventurer
When I first read this I was a little confused - I couldn't understand what you were looking for.

The d20 Future book lists a large number of things a sensor suite can do (and which you'd need to make a Sensor/Computer Use check for). Most of these don't have a direct mechanical bonus, but provide info (some of which is directly applicable to combat). Given the info provided, I didn't feel a real need for any other bonuses.

As for ranges - if the ship is in combat, its opponents are well within sensor range, given the absurdly short ranges for ship based weapons. If a ship isn't in combat, sensor use will probably wait until the ship is within whatever the effective range is. The only time it really matters is for encounter distance (which I generally set through GM fiat). If you want to setup situations like Weber uses in Harrington-space, you'll need to use a completely different combat system.

I must admit though, that I'm starting to see the problems people are having with ship combat. Here's a suggestion - Sensors = Spot/Search checks enabled. Stealth systems = Hide/Move Silent checks enabled. Change range increments to "squares" and use the space scale.
 

Masada

First Post
The issues I'm encountering are out of combat. Say I'm 20 miles from a ship, can it "see" my ship? Does it know I'm following?

And even in combat... what if my ship design is unique? will sensor's automatically detect my custom PL 7 bogon cannon dealing 12d6 x 10?

DC 15 checks are chump and there are no modifiers for anything. What if I'm jamming? What if I'm shielded? What if I'm actively trying to hide my illegal nuclear missiles? What if I'm behind a big rock? Etc.

There's a lot more that could be defined and it can be critical to story line. Then based on how sensors work, players (or the GM) can take tactical advantages based on who sees who first. I don't want to make it too complex, but nearly everything about starships in d20 future only relates to combat and few details are given about non-combat capabilities.
 

Johnny Angel

Explorer
d20 Future sensor arrays are packages of sensor systems used in Alternity Warships. Warships defines the ranges of these sensor types individually, with some systems being available in more powerful versions. I have broken up the sensor subsystems below by d20 Future Sensor Array class, and listed the ranges given in Warships, with the assumption that the higher-range versions appear at PL 8 and 9. Note that 1 megameter is approximately equal to five of the d20 Future 500-foot squares. The ranges are expressed as short/medium/long, where short range requires no modifier, medium range requires a -2 modifier, and long range requires a -6 modifier. Beyond long range, the sensor is useless.

Class I (PL 5)
Air/Space Radar 5/10/20 Mm
Hi-Res Video 1/2/10 Mm
IR Detector 2/4/8 Mm

Class II (PL 6)
Air/Space Radar 5/10/20 Mm
EM Detector 10/20/60 Mm
Hi-Res Video 1/2/10 Mm
IR Detector 2/4/8 Mm
Ladar 5/10/30 Mm

Class III (PL 6)
Air/Space Radar 5/10/20 Mm
EM Detector 10/20/60 Mm
Hi-Res Video 1/2/10 Mm
IR Detector 2/4/8 Mm
Ladar 5/10/30 Mm

Class IV (PL 7)
Air/Space Radar 5/10/20 Mm
EM Detector 10/20/60 Mm
Hi-Res Video 1/2/10 Mm
IR Detector 2/4/8 Mm
Ladar 5/10/30 Mm
Mass Detector 10/30/50 Mm
Multiband Radar 10/20/40 Mm
Spectroanalyzer 2/4/16 Mm, 1/5/25 AU

Class V (PL 7)
Air/Space Radar 5/10/20 Mm
EM Detector 10/20/60 Mm
Hi-Res Video 1/2/10 Mm
IR Detector 2/4/8 Mm
Ladar 5/10/30 Mm
Mass Detector 10/30/50 Mm
Multiband Radar 10/20/40 Mm
Spectroanalyzer 2/4/16 Mm, 1/5/25 AU

Class VI (PL 8)
Air/Space Radar 5/10/20 Mm
EM Detector 30/60/180 Mm
Hi-Res Video 1/2/10 Mm
IR Detector 2/4/8 Mm
Ladar 5/10/30 Mm
Mass Detector 30/90/150 Mm
Multiband Radar 10/20/40 Mm
Spectroanalyzer 2/4/16 Mm, 1/5/25 AU
Madar 20/30/40 Mm
Multiphase Radar 20/40/80 Mm

Class VII (PL 8)
Air/Space Radar 5/10/20 Mm
EM Detector 30/60/180 Mm
Hi-Res Video 1/2/10 Mm
IR Detector 2/4/8 Mm
Ladar 5/10/30 Mm
Mass Detector 30/90/150 Mm
Multiband Radar 10/20/40 Mm
Spectroanalyzer 2/4/16 Mm, 1/5/25 AU
Madar 20/30/40 Mm
Multiphase Radar 20/40/80 Mm

Class VIII (PL 9)
Air/Space Radar 5/10/20 Mm
EM Detector 100/200/600 Mm
Hi-Res Video 1/2/10 Mm
IR Detector 2/4/8 Mm
Ladar 5/10/30 Mm
Mass Detector 100/300/500 Mm
Multiband Radar 10/20/40 Mm
Spectroanalyzer 2/4/16 Mm, 1/5/25 AU
Madar 20/30/40 Mm
Multiphase Radar 20/40/80 Mm

Class IX (PL 9)
Air/Space Radar 5/10/20 Mm
EM Detector 100/200/600 Mm
Hi-Res Video 1/2/10 Mm
IR Detector 2/4/8 Mm
Ladar 5/10/30 Mm
Mass Detector 100/300/500 Mm
Multiband Radar 10/20/40 Mm
Spectroanalyzer 2/4/16 Mm, 1/5/25 AU
Madar 20/30/40 Mm
Multiphase Radar 20/40/80 Mm
 

GuardianLurker

Adventurer
Masada said:
The issues I'm encountering are out of combat. Say I'm 20 miles from a ship, can it "see" my ship? Does it know I'm following?
Unless you're actively hiding I'd say yes. Note that 20 miles is not on any d20 combat scale. You're fully in the GM fiat range here?

And even in combat... what if my ship design is unique? will sensor's automatically detect my custom PL 7 bogon cannon dealing 12d6 x 10?
According to the rules, yep. Of course, you'd probably need a high class sensor to get what you're asking. A more likely answer is "Unique weapon design, apparent progress level 7".

DC 15 checks are chump and there are no modifiers for anything. What if I'm jamming? What if I'm shielded? What if I'm actively trying to hide my illegal nuclear missiles? What if I'm behind a big rock? Etc.
Jamming requires Sensor Jammers; -5 to Computer Use rolls (or +5 to DC, whichever).
If by shielded, you mean something similar to the Stealth Shield, it's -10.
The big rock is either the equivalent to Stealth Shielding, or The Cloaking Device. If the latter, the ship is effectively invisible.
For the nuclear missles, you'd need a full ECM suite, and I'm not sure d20 has that.

I don't want to make it too complex, but nearly everything about starships in d20 future only relates to combat and few details are given about non-combat capabilities.
That's because the non-combat capabilities are generally completely RP points, completely under the GM's control.
 

Masada

First Post
Yeah I can adjunct about anything. But I don't like doing things to my players like "well you couldn't detect the ship" without giving them any means to prevent it or even realizing it's possible.
 

GuardianLurker

Adventurer
Right. Which is why I suggested the Hide/Spot stuff. Basically, just treat the encounters like you would a normal d20 wilderness encounter. Considering that they've tried to make ship combat work as much like normal combat as possible, it should work well.
 

Masada

First Post
I don't like the Hide/Spot system because unless you declare that this is a special ship Hide skill and not the regular Hide skill, you are basically saying that because a character is good at hiding in hallways, they are also good at hiding starships. :\

So being a compulse rule writer... I've worked up this...

Sensor Range Increments
All sensor systems have range increments based on PL. All systems have a maximum range of 5 increments. Each increment beyond the 1st imposes a -2 penalty to function check made at that distance.

PL 5 range increment: 1000 miles (Max 5,000 miles)
PL 6 range increment: 5000 miles (Max 25,000 miles)
PL 7 range increment: 20,000 miles (Max 100,000 miles)
PL 8 range increment: 50,000 miles (Max 250,000 miles)
PL 9 range increment: 100,000 miles (Max 500,000 miles)

Planetary systems or space stations can put much more power behind their systems. Multiply the range increment of a stationary sensor system by 100. This only applies to detailed scan results. Stationary systems can detect object (ships) at a range of 8 trillion miles (about the size of our solar system) if they know where to look (i.e. they receive a transmission from the ship) and the ship is not shadowed by another object.

A ship’s sensors only operate at the range specified unless otherwise noted. By default sensors operate at immediate range, but if manually tuned to work at farther range increments by ship personnel, the sensor now are only focused on the new range increment. This leaves the ship blind at other ranges including immediate range. Secondary sensor arrays can be installed to operate at two ranges simultaneously and some of the higher end sensor systems can operate at multiple ranges.

Proximity alarms
Most starships systems routinely scan the immediate range for objects on a direct collision course with the ship. Alarms will also sound when another identifiable starship (an object with a detectable energy signature) approaches with in immediate range. Part of this functionality is the normal operating procedure of ship systems to signal each other via transponders. In order to even attempt to “sneak up” on a target vessel a ship must disable its own transponder. A ship without a transponder signal is generally assumed to be hostile.

Transponder signals
A normal transponder transmits the following ship information in a radius of 1000 miles: ship name, port of origin/nationality, current heading and speed, autopilot enable/disabled, voyage priority.

A ship name is assigned when the ship is constructed. Officially changing a ship name takes 48 hours and must be registered with the port of origin. This requires a Knowledge (Civics) check 25 and a purchase DC of 20. This can be combined with a port of origin change at no additional cost.

Port of Origin/Nationality is assigned at ship construction. This designates who owns the ship and what nationality it is for tax/administrative purposes. Changing nationality of ship requires 48 hours, a Knowledge (Civics) 25 check and a purchase DC of 20. This can be combined with a name change at no additional cost.

The current heading and speed of a vessel is broadcast to help facilitate auto-nav systems.

Autopilot status is included so that the ship navigator/pilot or autopilot can make minor course adjustments to maintain a safety buffer of 5000 feet.

A priority is set to indicate the importance of the ship mission. There are a variety of codes ranging from Emergency Vehicle (1) to Garbage Scow (1000). Priority codes 5 and below do not have to respond to distress signals. Other priorities are obligated to respond to distress signals. Ship transponders signals are logged automatically by all vessels that receive it. If a ship fails to respond to a distress and that ship later is rescued by another vessel, then the offending ship will be impounded and the captain banned from piloting another vessel.

Disabling a transponder is a free action requiring a DC 15 Computer Use check. The ability to disable a transponder is a common safety feature in space where even honest ships must “hide” from hostile forces. However, ship caught in major shipping lanes with disabled transponders will always be boarded and may be fired upon.

Forging/altering a transponder signal takes 1d4 minutes. Transponder systems are encrypted and typically installed by transport authorities to be tamper proof. As such modifying one requires a Computer Use check DC 30 for each element forged.

Sensor conditions
There are a variety of conditions that affect sensor performance. Most are caused by close proximity to planets, stars or other massive celestial objects. Here are some suggestions.

Gas Giant: Massive planets like Jupiter have enormous magnetic fields many times more powerful than Earth’s own. Such forces reduce all range increments by half when the ship is within 250,000 miles of the planet.
Solar: Stars also produce large magnetic fields and emit masses of particles at their respective “north” and “south” poles. Ships positioned inside this solar wind are invisible to detection from sources outside the effect. Source inside the effect can only operate sensors at immediate range with a -5 penalty to checks.
Debris Fields: Sensor systems can be overwhelmed by multitudes of objects. These conditions can be encountered in asteroid fields, large debris fields or any where thousands of huge objects are encountered. Detecting a specific object in this area (like a ship without a transponder) imposes a -10 penalty.
Hard Radiation: Typically encountered inside nebula or at the sight of particularly catastrophic battles, hard radiation imposes a -2 penalty to all sensor checks.
Gas Clouds: Masses of tiny particles impact visual sensors as well as laser based systems. Range increments of ship sensors are halved.


Beating sensors
Skilled pilots and sensor operators can help mask a ship in space. This generally falls in to two categories—becoming invisible and masquerading as something else. Pilots can hide their ship in debris fields, gas clouds and behind other larger objects with a pilot check that is then opposed by any sensor checks. A ship can only hide behind objects larger than itself.

Sensor operators can use their own ship systems to fake readings. The operator uses their Computer Use skill to attempt the masquerade with the following modifiers. Remember to add in range modifiers.

Downgrade/Upgrade the PL of all weapons one step; -4 to the roll.
Fake the top speed of the ship by 500’ (+/-); -2 to the roll.
Increase/Decrease detected lifeforms by 20%; -4 to the roll.
Completely mask lifeforms; -4 to the roll (it is easier to completely hide than fake the number).

Relative sensors
Upgraded systems provide an advantage to detecting tampering and a bonus to masquerading. For each step difference between two ship’s sensors apply a +2 bonus to masquerades to the more advanced ship and a -2 penalty to the roll of a lesser ship. For example the Alpha encounters the Omega within 1000 miles. The Alpha is a smugglers ship and wants to avoid confrontation with the more powerful Omega. The Alpha has altered its transponders (a Computer Use check as above) and is masquerading as an unarmed private yacht. However, the Alpha only has a Class II Sensor array and the Omega has a Class VI. The Alpha will take an additional -4 (two steps difference) to its rolls to masquerade against the Omega. If the situation were reversed, then the Omega would enjoy a +4 advantage to its own masquerading attempts.

Running Silent
Ship sensors can be either “active” or “passive.” Active sensors send out energy looking for the “echoes” of the returning energy to gather data. Passive sensors emit nothing but instead only receive energy and try to interpret it. Any time a ship is actively making a check using its scanners they are considered active. Using active scanners is a dead give away of your current position to all ships inside your scanning range increment. Relying only on passive scanners to detect energy signatures is only possible inside 1000 miles and imposes a -15 penalty on analysis checks. Sensors in passive mode can only gather information about powered system in operation (i.e. engines, radio communications, active sensor arrays, charged weapons, weapons fire, energy shields, etc.) Determining the exact location of an object with no energy signatures using only passive sensors requires moving with in 5000’ of an object.

Navigating a ship without active sensors imposes a -10 penalty to Pilot checks, but also makes a ship undetectable (usually) beyond 1000 miles to passive sensors. A ship using active sensors takes a -10 penalty attempting to detect another ship running silently. A ship running silently moves at only ¼ speed.
 

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