Deadeye Shot Feat Question (PHB2)

[Egres]

Just one more observation:

assuming Hurling Charge lets you make a ranged attack on a charge, Cometary Collision lets you ready a charge, and the two work together, then the result would be a ranged attack on a readied charge, which I would consider a readied ranged attack. So probably yes, I would.

But the ranged attack here isn't direct result of the readied action.

Proof: you don't have to make the ranged attack as part of the charge.

Thus, how can you say that you have readied something that you can actually avoid to do?

The DMG explains how to deal with characters that want to "skip" their readied action, but in my example you have started the readied action, the charge with the CC feat, but you don't have to use the HC feat.

So, how can you argument that the eventual ranged attack is a readied action, since you didn't ready it and can avoid to do it?

 

[Hypersmurf]

But the ranged attack here isn't direct result of the readied action.

Certainly it is. Had you not taken the readied action, you would not have made the ranged attack.

Proof: you don't have to make the ranged attack as part of the charge.

If you make the ranged attack, it is part of the charge, and thus a result of the readied action.

If you don't make the ranged attack, you can't use Deadeye Shot anyway, so it's irrelevant.

Thus, how can you say that you have readied something that you can actually avoid to do?

The DMG explains how to deal with characters that want to "skip" their readied action, but in my example you have started the readied action, the charge with the CC feat, but you don't have to use the HC feat.

But if you do use the HC feat, you are making a ranged attack as the result of a readied action.

So, how can you argument that the eventual ranged attack is a readied action, since you didn't ready it and can avoid to do it?

I'm not arguing that the attack is a readied action; it's not an action at all. It's the result of an action which was readied.

-Hyp.

 

[Egres]

Certainly it is. Had you not taken the readied action, you would not have made the ranged attack.

Nope.

By your reasoning, it's your parents' fault if you kill someone.

Go and tell it to the court...

If you make the ranged attack, it is part of the charge, and thus a result of the readied action.

It's a part of the reaided action?

Absolutely not.

It's something I do in the middle of my readied action, and has nothing to do with the action itself cause I don't have to do it.

If you don't make the ranged attack, you can't use Deadeye Shot anyway, so it's irrelevant.

Thus, how can you say that you have readied something that you can actually avoid to do?

Easy: I have readied a charge, and I can choose to not use the HC charge feat.

So, I can ready something that isn't a readied ranged attack.

So, if I decide to add a ranged attack during my readied action, I will simply add something that I didn't ready.

Heck, if I can decide after I start the charge (the readied action) what to do, how can you affirm that I readied a ranged attack before.

It's blatantly illogical.

I'm not arguing that the attack is a readied action; it's not an action at all. It's the result of an action which was readied.

Nope.

It's not what you have readied at all.

 

[Hypersmurf]

It's something I do in the middle of my readied action, and has nothing to do with the action itself cause I don't have to do it.

How can it have nothing to do with the action, given that were it not for the action, you couldn't do it at all?

-Hyp.

 

[Egres]

How can it have nothing to do with the action, given that were it not for the action, you couldn't do it at all?

-Hyp.

It happens in the middle of the action, but you did not ready the ranged attack, but the charge.

DM:"It's your turn"

PC:"I ready an action"

DM"What action?"

PC:"A charge, using the Cometary Collision feat"

So, where's the readied ranged attack?

 

[Kapalen]

I just gotta say I side with Hyp here. And, if you know me, that means he's right.

 

[Hypersmurf]

So, where's the readied ranged attack?

If you readied the attack action, the ranged attack would occur in the middle of the action you readied as well. It just happens that in that case, the action doesn't allow anything else.

Since the attack occurs as part of the action in both cases, what's the difference?

-Hyp.

 

[Egres]

If you readied the attack action, the ranged attack would occur in the middle of the action you readied as well.

You have just admitted that you didn't ready the ranged attack.

Since the attack occurs as part of the action in both cases, what's the difference?

The difference is easy to see: in my example you didn't ready the ranged attack.

Thus, the DES feat can't apply.

 

[Legildur]

Egres,

I think I see where you are coming from, but I can't decide whether you can 'ready a ranged attack' or 'ready an attack'.

"You can ready a standard action, a move action, or a free action." (PHB p160)

Obviously a ranged attack can't result from a move action or free action, so we can concentrate on the standard action.

Standard actions consist of attack, cast a spell, activate magic item, use special ability, total defense, start/complete full-round action. (PHB pp139-142) Comprehensive examples are provided in table 8-2: actions in combat. Once again, we are only interested in the attack action.

So you ready an attack action (standard action) to time your blow with that of your ally in order to benefit from the DES feat.

But what I can't discern is whether you specifically ready an 'attack action' or a 'ranged attack'. Ranged attack (along with melee attack and unarmed attack) is listed explicitly under table 8-2, and so are other standard actions that don't otherwise appear in the list of standard actions I quoted from the PHB, above (for example, where does 'make a dying friend stable' fit in to the above list? I know it is listed under Miscellaneous actions (145)).

Is it readying an attack and then relying on a ranged attack to trigger the benefits of the feat? Or is it readying a ranged attack?

 

[Hypersmurf]

You have just admitted that you didn't ready the ranged attack.

In either case. In both cases, you readied an action, not an attack. In both cases, the attack is made as part of the readied action. But since an attack is not an action, it can never be directly readied; it can only ever be indirectly readied by readying the action the attack is part of.

The difference is easy to see: in my example you didn't ready the ranged attack.

You don't ready the ranged attack if you Ready the Attack action either. So, again - what's the difference?

-Hyp.