Disarm w/spiked chain

[Spove]

Ok, I just want to smoke test this ruling before it comes up in game. I am confident in my ruling, but want to see if anyone disagrees, or see if there is some obscure ruling that I am unaware of.

In the SRD it states that a disarm attempt provokes an AoO and in order to disarm "The character and an adjacent target make opposed attack rolls with the their respective weapons."

Firstly this "adjacent" thing will most likely be house ruled if it hasn't already been errated or covered in the FAQ. I see no logical reason why you can't make a disarm attempt with a reach weapon.

Moving forward with the last statement in affect; A disarm attempt with a reach weapon, against an opponent without a reach weapon, won't effectively provoke an AoO due to the fact that the opponent can't effectively reach the aggressor and therefore attack.

Thoughts?

 

[Bauglir]

I've seen it argued that you COULD use the AoO to disarm your opponent before they disarm you, or to sunder.

My personal feelings on the issue are if you don't threaten the creature, you don't threaten any of their equipment. While it allows this (minor imo) bit of cheese it keeps a whole can o worms closed wrt WHERE a creature's weapon is held.

(For example, what if I wait for an opponent to start poking someone 10' away with his halberd, then use a readied action to 'bull-rush' through the intervening space?)

 

[Lord Thurham]

I had asked this very same question a few weeks ago. This is what I ruled on it for my players.

Research Question: Can an opponent counter-disarm me if I try to disarm him/her with a reach weapon if they don’t threaten me with their own weapon.

Answer: Yes. The confusion might be from the fact that Disarm as an action does allow attacks of opportunity from the defender vs. the “Free” counter-disarm action allowed by the defender.

For example:
Question #1: I try to disarm someone 10 ft. away, they do not threaten me. Do they get the resulting attack of opportunity?

Answer to #1: No AoOs require the target to be in a threatened zone.

Question #2: I try to disarm someone 10 ft. away, they do not threaten me. Do they get the resulting counter-disarm if I fail?

Answer to #2: Yes. The counter-disarm is not an AoO, and nothing in the language of the Players Handbook page 137 requires the target to be in a threatened zone.



I hope this helps!

 

[Spove]

I agree that a counter disarm would indeed be permissible.

 

[kramis]

feed those flames

Just to add a little fuel to the fire ... if you do allow the sword to get an AoO (disarm and sunder only) when a 10' disarm is attempted with a spiked chain then you have to allow the spiked chain weilder to get their AoO for the disarm or sunder attempt on their chain, which of course could itself be another disarm attempt.

 

[Storm Raven]

Firstly this "adjacent" thing will most likely be house ruled if it hasn't already been errated or covered in the FAQ. I see no logical reason why you can't make a disarm attempt with a reach weapon.

Of course you can. If you couldn't, the ranseur would be pretty useless.

 

[Hypersmurf]

I've seen it argued that you COULD use the AoO to disarm your opponent before they disarm you, or to sunder.

Can't sunder with an AoO.

See PHB, Table 8-4.

-Hyp.

 

[Maitre Du Donjon]

But you can disarm, right?

Maitre D

 

[kreynolds]

Yup. Disarm, grapple, trip, use a feat.

 

[Saeviomagy]

Sunder IS a feat.

Attack an object is the non-feat version.

As an attack, I'd think that it's perfectly possible as an AoO.