D&D 5E [DM problem] Is the group I am leading too strong? Is the 5E system unbalanced?

[Jester David]

It still is a failure of communication.

WotC certainly doesn't get to both eat the cake (here! Lots of cool items!) and have it still (why you didn't think the game could handle actually using the 100+ pages of magic items!? We just wrote them, if you use them that's on you!)

In other words WotC shouldn't get away with not taking responsibility for making a game that cannot handle it's constituent parts.

They do not say "don't use feats and magic items unless you're okay with all our adventures becoming way too easy" on the label. In fact, they say next to nothing, hoping that apologists like you will deflect and shift the blame away.

Many DMs fall into this "trap". The blame for this should squarely rest in the lap of the designers.

I don't see how it's a failure of communication. They state pretty clearly that magic items are not assumed or required.

And they tried the alternative where magic items are assumed for the math, and that didn't work out very well.

What would you have done instead? Remove magic items from the game entirely? Make magic items cosmetic or only provide non-combat bonuses?
It's easy to find fault, but proposing a working alternative is harder...

 

[bbrown12]

Sorry, double post.

 

[Warmaster Horus]

I just increment the threat to something appropriate to the player characters. Takes some experience and nuance but works fine. Most published materials are on the low-end challenge side.

 

[DaveDash]

Try as you might, you cannot escape the fact a game can still be set to "easy" or "difficult" default difficulty.

And 5th edition is set to "hopelessly easy".

Can you change this? Yes. Can you make the game fun for players of every skill level? Yes.

Does it excuse WotC for defaulting to a carebearian (lack of) difficulty level?

No.

Sent from my C6603 using EN World mobile app

I've killed two PCs in Princes of the Apocalypse and had two near TPKs running it with zero adjustments. Just the other session I almost killed an 8th level Paladin in one hit (crit) from a bullete.

There's a lot of crazy nasty cultists in this module. CR 3 mage/priests with tons of hitpoints that can all cast three fireballs per day or three lightning bolts per day.
3-4 of them plus some trash cultists can cause serious damage to most groups under level 11.

There are quite a lot of easy fights too, but it's the way it is.

 

[Imaro]

Magical armour was not at the same level (the odd ring of protection and one set of +2 armour with others at +1). That was also deliberate as the top end AC issues are a complete pain once you go +3/+3 for a plate armoured/shielded character (or anywhere near it in fact...).

Yes but it's an add on effect right? Artefact level or equivalent weapons and items... All in at least +1 armour with a few in higher... This honestly seems like alot of magic items and pretty much guarantees a skewing of the encounter guidelines.

 

[DEFCON 1]

The good Captain and I don't agree too often on these forums, but he is absolutely on the money with his assessment here.

The CR system is completely borked - please see my post directly above on how I have to houserule to ensure challenge remains appropriate once high levels and magical items drop into the mix...

It's not the question of whether or not CR is borked or not, or whether the game is too easy or not...

...it's that he keeps harping on the fact that WotC hasn't released a statement "admitting" to this fact, and hasn't been writing down in their books "Hey everybody! This game is too easy for some of you!" It's like he needs reparations from WotC for their audacity to not put down explicit instructions in their books on how each level of game player needs to work the rules so it works best for them.

Which is absolutely ridiculous and would be a complete waste of page count in my opinion. I don't want them to write down the same information seven different times for seven different "levels" of player skill. If you are a so-called "skilled" player that finds the game too easy as written using their basic levels of information meant to help the newest players of this hobby who might want/need the assist... and yet can't figure out our can't be bothered to adjust them to work as you need them to for your game... that's on you.

And if you keep harping on the fact that WotC isn't apologizing to you for that... you're just whining.

 

[iserith]

... you're just whining.

And that's the only grounds that will cause me to block someone on these forums (and I have).

Rather than say the game is "unbalanced" or "easy," it would be more positive in my view to take pride in being a skilled player for whom the base expectations of the game are too easy and to make suggestions on how to enhance that for players of similar skill. Instead, we get the whining and the silly demands for acknowledgement. Unhelpful.

Back on topic, one thing that needs to be established before actionable advice can be proffered, however, is what goal the DM is trying to achieve. What does it look like when the players are properly challenged according to that DM? What do the players who are on the receiving end of the current difficulty level think? Until that is solidly addressed, all the disparate pieces of advice in this thread from the helpful posters can't really be analyzed for efficacy as I see it.

 

[cmad1977]

You could have an event or effect that improves the attack and damage of the enemies while in their lair.
'THE EARTH STONE IS CHARGED! MY CULTISTS WILL BE UNSTOPPABLE!!'


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[LordEntrails]

IMO, PotA encounters are flavor based, and certainly not optimized for combat. To make it harder (I'm going through similar things right now with my party)
- change up the caster's spells a bit, given them a higher level spell or two.
- Use better tactics, mobs know that your party has fireballs, so they should never group up, even to swarm the front line.
- More encounters per day, even the bad guys know the barbarian can only rage so many times, hit the party enough to make him rage then have them run away only to return an hour later.

I'm sure you got lots of good advice in the last 60+ posts. Adapt and overcome

 

[Flexor the Mighty!]

If you want to reapply a higher difficulty, making monsters even beefier is probably not the best way.

It merely makes combat take longer. You might think it tips the scales, but what it really does (in touch and go cases) is force players to expend more limited resources - they still win.

Instead, either reduce the hit points of PCs or increase monster damage.

There's no need to formally give monsters feats and such. Just add, say, the monster's proficiency bonus to every roll it makes: attacks, damage rolls and saves.

Instant jump in difficulty level.



Sent from my C6603 using EN World mobile app

I do that often, kick the damage dice up one die. I always give leader types and whatnot max HP, the rest I just roll them. Reducing the HP of PC is not an option.

At the same time despite the flaws playing 3.5e at 11-13th level last night reminded me what a slog that game is. Is the 2-3 round easy combat of 5e better though...